removing large platter from the wheel

[Mark C.]

Its most likely to thin at this point. You could re -wedge that clay when its still wet and throw one with a bit more clay so its thicker.

[Bill Kielb]

14” is tough and any crease you put in it will likely reappear because the clay has been stretched locally so I think really tough to get off without bending it. I agree with the rewedge with some more clay and throw it on a full batt. Sorry, just my opinion.

[Lbegley]

Keep the wire tight and press down against the wheel head as you drag it across.   I spin the wheel slowly as I do it.  I cut plenty of crooked bottoms before realizing that I was inadvertently coming up as I moved the wire.

[Pres]

I have seen people throw large 14 inch or so plates with no bat, and lift them off the wheel holding only one edge with both hands lift, and it bends all over, then they lay it on a ware board and it flattens right out. Think I can do it! NO. . . dang it!

I throw mine on bats, just threw a 24 inch ring on a bat for the wall of a long bread dish for communion set order.  assembled with a slab base and decorated with same stamps I used on the two chalices for the set.

 

best,

Pres

[Benzine]

13 hours ago, hantremmer said:

I've got a similar issue - except I've got a 14" plate directly on a 14" wheelhead.  No bat.   Plate is thin enough that I can see the wire rippling the clay as I pull it underneath.

I've covered it with a bag and am going to leave it overnight, so it will have 24 hours or so drying slowly.   What tips to getting this off the wheel safely and (reasonably) undeformed?

 

Invest in some pottery "Scoops".  Thin pieces of metal used to get under the bottom of soft wares, on the wheel.  If you don't have those, you can just use a piece of sheet metal, or something of the like, to achieve the same purpose. 

Alternately, when it is set up enough, just try and scoot it off the wheel head, to the side, on to a bat or ware board. 

[hantremmer]

Thanks for all the replies.  I manged to get it off.  

I think the platter is 6-8mm thick and a little over 13" across (my wheelhead isn't 14" as I first thought, so my dimensions were off).

I wired off with a curly wire.   I had to use a 3mm thick piece of cardboard as a wareboard, so I lifted the platter up a little and placed the 'board underneath.  Repeated a few times.  WHen the platter was half way on I lifted it gently by the rim and placed it.   The rim deformed a little and the platter was floppy, but not as badly as I expected.   I left the rim thick, which helped. 

My Shimpo didn't come with holes for bat pins, but it does have marks on where to drill. So I'm thinking of drilling fresh ones or buying a already drilled wheelhead.

 

[Min]

@hantremmer, another option is to leave the wheelhead as it is and use a clay donut or pancake to stick the batts to. Use some scrap clay and throw and flat, level donut or pancake on the wheelhead then put your batt on that. For plaster batts and wooden ones under 8" or so in diameter I use the Xiem BatMate, works really well,  the batts need to be flat and not warped, no pins necessary.

[hantremmer]

17 minutes ago, Min said:

@hantremmer, another option is to leave the wheelhead as it is and use a clay donut or pancake to stick the batts to. Use some scrap clay and throw and flat, level donut or pancake on the wheelhead then put your batt on that. For plaster batts and wooden ones under 8" or so in diameter I use the Xiem BatMate, works really well,  the batts need to be flat and not warped, no pins necessary.

 

I bought the Xiem batmate, I think after reading about your experiences, but while initially I thought it was a solution for me I've found it hard to get it to the right moisture to stick properly.  A few times when I've been centring it's slid off; it's been frustrating enough for me to put it down.

I have used clay pancakes occasionally before, but I suppose I'm looking for a more permanent fix.  Perhaps I will try to use them more consistency to see if it can be a part of my routine.  

 

[Benzine]

I had to drill some pin holes on a few of the wheels, in my  classroom, including a Shimpo, that had pins, but the wrong size, spaced the wrong distance. 

Even with marks, it is a good idea to use a punch first, so the drill doesn't wobble off the mark. 

Also make sure to clean the wheel, before and after drilling the holes, so you don't end up with metal shavings in your clay.

[Joy pots]

I’ve used wallpaper on my bats for years.  You cut out circles the size you wish attach them to bats with water or slip.  To remove you run your wire between bat & wallpaper to remove once the piece is firm enough you peel off the wallpaper.  I pick up wallpaper ends from garage sales or wherever you can get it cheap.  It can also be reused. 

Joy

[Benzine]

37 minutes ago, Joy pots said:

I’ve used wallpaper on my bats for years.  You cut out circles the size you wish attach them to bats with water or slip.  To remove you run your wire between bat & wallpaper to remove once the piece is firm enough you peel off the wallpaper.  I pick up wallpaper ends from garage sales or wherever you can get it cheap.  It can also be reused. 

Joy

And if you use some of the more textured type of wallpaper, you'd have some interesting/ decorative bottoms!

[hantremmer]

Joy - I don't understand what the wallpaper is for. Is it to prolong the life of the bat?

Benzine - The teacher at my pottery class is reticent to drill holes in her wheelheads just in case something goes awry.  I too was thinking about the repurcussions of the hole being at a slight angle.  I don't have the tools to do it properly here, but I know someone with a woodworking workshop so I'll see if they can help.  A already drilled wheelhead is a £170, so that's a lot of money.

[neilestrick]

Drilling a wheel head isn't too difficult. Most of them are aluminum, so they drill easily. The holes should be 1/4", and 10" apart on center. Bat pins are 1/4-20 socket cap screws. You can center up a good bat and mark the holes as a starting point for your measurements. Use a punch first, then drill with a small bit, like 1/8" to start, and work up to the 1/4". Go slowly, and keep checking your drill from two sides to keep it fairly plumb. If it's not 100% plumb it's not a deal breaker. If you mess up, you can always drill a new set of holes a couple inches away from the bad ones. Extra holes in the head won't hurt anything, or you can fill them with JB Weld exoxy putty.

[Bill Kielb]

Hey did you ever try and drill these to a snug  fit to be used without wing nuts? Maybe a letter D drill.

[neilestrick]

1 hour ago, Bill Kielb said:

Hey did you ever try and drill these to a snug  fit to be used without wing nuts? Maybe a letter D drill.

If you don't want to use wing nuts, just thread the hole and use short bat pins. It's really easy to tap aluminum. I did that to one of my wheels once. I would only do it if you don't plan to remove the pins often (or ever), because it's more difficult to remove them than with wing nuts. You have to clean out the holes in the tops of the pins so you can get an Allen wrench in there, and they can seize up pretty good once the clay particles work their way in.

[Fred Sweet]

Neil- 

It is not just the fact that clay particles get into the threads of a tapped aluminum wheel head, although that is a contributing factor. There is also galvanic corrosion occurring, where two dissimilar metals oxidize at an accelerated rate in the presence of water.

Regards,

Fred

[Babs]

I also have sen a potter just lift the plate up by the rim and place it flat on wareboard..

I use Min's doughnut of clay but i make concentric. rings to the wheel head into it. Then I indent it like the spokes of a wheel.

I refresh the rings and dents after a couple of bats have been on it. This seems to stop any sliding of bat under pressure of centering.

If I hah had 2 wheels I would have considered pins but with 1 and a giffen grip.. havent gone there.

[Bill Kielb]

1 hour ago, neilestrick said:

If you don't want to use wing nuts, just thread the hole and use short bat pins. It's really easy to tap aluminum. I did that to one of my wheels once. I would only do it if you don't plan to remove the pins often (or ever), because it's more difficult to remove them than with wing nuts. You have to clean out the holes in the tops of the pins so you can get an Allen wrench in there, and they can seize up pretty good once the clay particles work their way in.

That was why I wondered if anyone had tried the snug drill trick. Just set them in and go.

[neilestrick]

40 minutes ago, Fred Sweet said:

Neil- 

It is not just the fact that clay particles get into the threads of a tapped aluminum wheel head, although that is a contributing factor. There is also galvanic corrosion occurring, where two dissimilar metals oxidize at an accelerated rate in the presence of water.

Regards,

Fred

Even after a few hours they can be tough to get out.

[Hulk]

Bill Van Gilder drops in pins in his videos - no threading.

Anti seize might help; be sure to pick the appropriate when aluminum is involved. I just leave the pins in, wingnutted; bolt and wingnut are low series stainless, and antisieze has been applied against ever removing them. When I need a clay pad, said pad goes on a plastic bat; so far so good - don't like leaving a clay pad on the wheel head anyway.

 

[Babs]

8 hours ago, neilestrick said:

Even after a few hours they can be tough to get out.

Clay pad only there for time you're throwing...

How do you stick the plastic bat to wheelhead?

[Bill Kielb]

5 hours ago, Hulk said:

Bill Van Gilder drops in pins in his videos - no threading.

Anti seize might help; be sure to pick the appropriate when aluminum is involved. I just leave the pins in, wingnutted; bolt and wingnut are low series stainless, and antisieze has been applied against ever removing them. When I need a clay pad, said pad goes on a plastic bat; so far so good - don't like leaving a clay pad on the wheel head anyway.

 

I thought I saw someone do that. I do when I am lazy and don’t mind the slight movement. Anti seize good choice, there are plenty of conditions when aluminum and stainless react especially with water present. There is a condition where a newly installed stainless bolt once initially tightened is basically fused without the use of antifreeze.

[Hulk]

Hi Babs!

I often use bats with pins, hence, when a clay pad is needed, I'm using a plastic bat (on bat pins), clay pad on plastic bat - I'll refresh the clay pad with a sponge, re-groove it, an' cover it with plastic when it's not in use - keep right on using it for days! ...no removing/installing pins, an' flexible for what's next as well.

[hantremmer]

Thanks for all the feedback on bats, pins, pancakes and other bits and bobs.

[Joy pots]

The wallpaper becomes an easily removable bat & no it doesn’t have to be rough I use smooth wallpaper some times it has a slight raised pattern like the marks on cloth.  I slide it off the bat or wheel head after wiring off under the wallpaper.

Once the pot is firm enough to flip you peel the wallpaper off the bottom.

joy