Clay from bags always too hard

[HenryBurlingame]

Hi all, so I was wondering how common this was. I have been trying a lot of new cone 6 clay bodies from various suppliers and I am finding that a lot of the time the clay is too hard to wedge or throw straight out of the bag, sometimes waaay too hard even though the manufacturing date was only a few months ago (I’m looking at you Seattle pottery supply!). Is this pretty common? I guess I’m going to have to spend today adding water to bags and flipping them every few hours, but man it is making me want to just decide on one clay body and get a pugmill lol.

Edited September 22 by HenryBurlingame

[PeterH]

Some ideas in ...

 

[LinR]

I also use the clay bag in the bucket method which works well.  One caution, make sure your clay bag has no holes.  That's a sure way to get slop!  Lin

[Rae Reich]

Back a few decades ago, we students at Santa Ana College were able to go over to Aardvark, where they were mixing and bagging their clays, press our thumbs into the bags and choose which boxes to buy. Those were the days!

Has anyone tried recently, on volume orders, to request softer clay?

[LeeU]

On 9/18/2024 at 11:57 AM, HenryBurlingame said:

(I’m looking at you Seattle pottery supply!)

I use them and have always gotten satisfactory clay-not too soft and not too hard. I got 50 lbs this week (I'm in NH) and it is perfect. If you haven't contacted them and spoken directly with someone, it might well be  worth letting them know you have an issue. (If you have talked to them and gotten no resolution, if it were me I'd contact again and make some noise!) 

[Denice]

Cone 5/6 feel hard but can be soften up easily.   I have a tall 5gal bucket,  I put the bag of clay in it tied end up,  I fill it with water and leave the tied end of the bag sticking out of the water.   It depends on how hard the clay on how long you leave it in the bucket.   If it is really hard add a half cup of water.   I have revived some really  dry old clay,  it takes more water and a longer soak,  clay I just purchased only takes a day.  When I take a bag out I will check and see if I have more that needs to be soaked.  The water has never gone bad,  I usually have to add more,  if I do need to dump it I roll it out and dump it in the driveway.  I use to do the slamming method or dropping it 4 or 5 times on the floor to soften it.   I like the the texture of the soaked clay better,   perfect for throwing.  The water pressure rearranges the alignment of the clay and water with in the bagged clay.  I have a lot of different clay's in my studio,  I keep my bucket filled with water and on a 3 wheeled caster so I can move it around.    Bought a bunch of them on sale at Menards,  perfect size and will handle heavy loads.  Right now I am working with a black clay that is really stiff,  I didn't soften it because I am working on a sculpture.     It takes a lifetime to learn all of the secrets of clay,  when I was four years old I made a mosaic tray and got hooked on clay.   I will be 72 in two weeks still learning and hooked on clay.    Denice

[HenryBurlingame]

I will try the bucket method and see if that is any different from just adding water to the bag... I have always just added water to the bag, rotated it a few times, and in a few days the clay seems pretty consistently softer.

On 9/20/2024 at 6:18 PM, LeeU said:

I use them and have always gotten satisfactory clay-not too soft and not too hard.

Most of the clay I got from them in my last order was about 6+ months old, with one bag over a year old according to the date on the package. Had to add about a cup of water to every bag to just be able to wedge them comfortably, and a little more to be able to extrude or slab roll without issues. The year-old bag was acting really strange - super short and floppy so I just gave up on it, water wasn't going to save that one lol. Maybe just bad luck on my part, but I have liked almost every other clay I have tried more than the SPS stuff, but I am still going to use it all and see what I think as far as finished pots look, how absorption turns out, etc. before I make any final decisions.

Edited September 22 by HenryBurlingame

[Morgan]

Before you add water etc slam the heck out of it on a concrete floor on each side. I order clay by the tons and all the bags of clay feel harder than a rock. Once you slam them it "wakes" up the clay. If it is still too hard, then do the water/bucket method. 

[Mark C.]

I use a diffent method. I use a small throwing sponge to measure water-drop sponge in water and then squeeze into opened bag then seal it and lay flat and flip it each day so all 4 sides get wet. Rebox  or use. I have done this in 250# of clay  at a time in my clay shed for decades. The trick is to know is it one or two sponge fulls-that you learn over time on the hardness factor.This is for porcealin that is harder to rewet than any stoneware.

Edited September 29 by Mark C.

[Kelly in AK]

Through my decades of hands in clay I’d never heard of this until last year when a production potter mentioned it: Penetrometer testing. He had a specific number and if the clay didn’t meet the measure he didn’t buy it. His supplier (Laguna) was aware of the requirement and the consistency of clay wasn’t ever an issue for him because of that.

Now, I want to point out that this very scientific test is essentially the same thing as poking your finger in a bag of clay. It’s just measured on a scale.

The moral of the story is: Poke the clay before you pay. 

[Pres]

All of the above work for me. However, if I want to use it immediately, I cut it with a wiggle wire into bread slices, spray with water and slam them together, making the wiggle lines perpendicular on each piece, then wedge. I know, takes time and energy, but when throwing plates it works well.  If I'm throwing off the hump I just get it shaped for throwing.

 

 

best,

Pres

[Joe H]

It would seem that the clay I purchase is consistently to hard to work out of the bag.  Sometimes I get a good batch, but not often.  Slamming the clay helps.  But not to my needs.  As a result of my frustration, I fabricated a clay grater.  It's a simple 1" x 4" pine rectangle, 14" wide, 24" long and 3 1/2" tall.  I securely stapled 1/4" hardware cloth to the bottom. To use it, I flip it over, screen side up. I make 3 or 4 passes with the hard clay over the grater, then I use a spray bottle to spray the clay until it just lets go of the screen. I repeat the grating process with all the clay.  About 4 lbs at a time seems to be a good quantity to work.  Once I have grated and wet the clay as I grated it, I pull the grater from the pile of nicely uniform product.  I roll the clay into a loaf, and start wedging my re-hydrated clay.  I wedge no less than 100 times.  I have had very good success with this process.  It's not terribly time consuming, and in my opinion is much more effective than bag soaking. I achieve a much more homogenous clay body.  I usually let my clay temper for a while (3 or4) hours after the first wedging. Then I always wedge before I actually throw a piece.  The grater is easy to make and cheap. and even works on leather hard clay.  Hope you find this helpful.