Postage costs for a mug in your country?

[PottaFella]

I'd like to keep this specific, because I'm trying to draw comparisons between different countries' postage costs and it's not always easy to comprehend the complicated price lists and  offerings.  Specifically, I'm trying to gain an understanding of how customers in other countries may view my postal charges against their own.  Perhaps this will help you do the same?

So, if anyone kindly wishes to contribute, the parameters I'm setting  are... a 6" x 6" x 6" card box containing a single pottery item (like a small mug), total package weight being between 500 and 750 grams. I have only included signed-for services assuming all our pottery is handmade and priceless (though if forced to put a price on it we'd probably say between 30 and 60 bucks  ).

Here in the UK if I take my 6" x 6" x 6" package to the local Post Office it will cost to send by Royal Mail...

UK address to UK address
2nd Class (2-3 day) signed for with £50 compensation for loss or damage... £3.95 ($5.03)
1st Class (1 day) signed for with £50 compensation for loss or damage... £4.45 ($5.67)
Guaranteed Next Day by 1pm with (up to) £500 compensation for loss or damage... £8.60  ($10.95)

UK address to Europe (any address)
Tracked & Signed (3-5 working days) with £50 compensation for loss or damage... £11.60  ($14.77)

UK address to USA (any address)
Tracked & Signed (5-7 working days) with £50 compensation for loss or damage... £15.15  (US$19.29)  (CAD$ 25.70)

• I've worked exchange rate at 8 Dec 2018... £1 = $1.27

• Note all delivery times are estimates except for the UK Guaranteed Next Day service. 

[liambesaw]

It's about the same here in the US, both domestically and internationally.  I know Canadian post is very expensive and third party logistics companies are more affordable there (dhl, ups, etc). 

Id like to see some other countries post their costs, this is a great idea to see some comparisons (although I'm sure all of these prices could be found online too)

[Min]

6" cube, weighting 750 grams. Canada Post regular rate, ceramics is not insurable.

From one coast of Canada to the other rates go from 17.07 up to 53.31

From west coast of Canada to Florida goes from 17.16 up to 63.20

From west coast of Canada to England goes from 20.33 up to 85.21

All in CA dollars, which are worth about .75 of a US greenback. I think these rates are lower than what I usually see as the size is so small the 6" cube  qualifies for small parcel rate. We can get a discount, it's for small businesses and is based on the number of parcels you ship per year. It's a bit off the regular rates but not much. The duties and taxes vary depending on where you are shipping to, Canada Post is the most reasonable for doing the brokerage, courier companies really ding US parcels coming into Canada on these.

[PottaFella]

12 hours ago, Min said:

6" cube, weighting 750 grams. Canada Post regular rate, ceramics is not insurable.

From west coast of Canada to Florida goes from 17.16 up to 63.20

That is really interesting, makes UK to USA any address Tracked & Signed (5-7 working days) with £50 compensation for loss or damage look extremely good value... £15.15  ($19.29 US)  (CAD $25.70)

 

[JohnnyK]

14 hours ago, Min said:

6" cube, weighting 750 grams. Canada Post regular rate, ceramics is not insurable.

From one coast of Canada to the other rates go from 17.07 up to 53.31

From west coast of Canada to Florida goes from 17.16 up to 63.20

From west coast of Canada to England goes from 20.33 up to 85.21

All in CA dollars, which are worth about .75 of a US greenback. I think these rates are lower than what I usually see as the size is so small the 6" cube  qualifies for small parcel rate. We can get a discount, it's for small businesses and is based on the number of parcels you ship per year. It's a bit off the regular rates but not much. The duties and taxes vary depending on where you are shipping to, Canada Post is the most reasonable for doing the brokerage, courier companies really ding US parcels coming into Canada on these.

Are they still using dog sleds to transport mail in Canada, Min?

[Callie Beller Diesel]

I have the Canada Post business card, and you can just sign up for it if you have something as small as an etsy account. They don't ask for any credentials other than your business name to sign up for one. I don't know at what point the volume discount kicks in, but I usually only send a handful of packages a year. I tend to use an 8x8x8 box, as its in the same category as the 6by and allows for more cushioning. They do allow a minimal $100 basic merchandise insurance rate, and that's included in the Tracked Package option, which is available to business customers and not the general public. The business rate I get is about $3 cheaper than what Min quotes at all points, and within Canada is usually delivered within 5 business days.

We have a very physically large country and a relatively small population. It means there's a lot of infrastructure and not as many people to pay for it, so the price per item goes up. 

And no one uses dog sleds: those are for the tourists. The Arctic posties use snowmobiles and centralized pickup.

[neilestrick]

Shipping prices here can vary greatly, mostly depending on how far you're shipping it. Or sometimes how not far you're shipping it. It costs me about the same, sometimes more, to ship something into Chicago (an hour away) vs shipping it to Iowa, the next state over via UPS. For small stuff the US Postal Service is usually cheapest, but once you get into packages that are larger than a 12" cube, UPS is competitive. It also depends on what type of account you have with UPS (I get good discounts with my business account), and what system you're using for shipping with USPS- Etsy, eBay and other sales systems often have discount pricing available.

[Mark C.]

The thing about shipping one small item for me is this-yes it cheaper to mail it but I have to take it to a post office personally and that takes time.

I live in a rural area (rural route) and I can only mail out anything less than 13 ounces in m y oversize mailbox on the street.Over that  13oz it needs to be taken to a post office. The exception is E-bay items paid for thru their system. which their label.

I do not like waiting in line or driving to mail a pot.

I use UPS most of the time even for small stuff as my time also fits into that cost evaluation  and the USPS sucks up my time.For UPS I Create the label and print it and the discount is up to 40% for my UPS business account.They pick up for free and I know my driver-I can call him if needed and we talk every week.The post office well thats a whole different animal .

The tracking is about 100% better with UPS than the poor tracking with USPS.

So back to the narrow window of cost only-the USPS cost is more as it takes more time to ship for me.This added time cost tips the scale.I would rather make another pot in the time it takes to drive to the post office.

[PottaFella]

54 minutes ago, Mark C. said:

So back to the narrow window of cost only-the USPS cost is more as it takes more time to ship for me.This added time cost tips the scale.I would rather make another pot in the time it takes to drive to the post office.

I'd be really interesting to see the figures for the 6" x  6" x 6" package 500g – 750g?  USPS v UPS, if possible with / without the discount?

[liambesaw]

4 hours ago, Mark C. said:

I live in a rural area (rural route) and I can only mail out anything less than 13 ounces in m y oversize mailbox on the street.Over that  13oz it needs to be taken to a post office. The exception is E-bay items paid for thru their system. which their label.

Just to save you time and money, here is a direct link to print postage through eBay/PayPal including the discounts and free pickup: 

http://PayPal.com/shipnow

 

[PottaFella]

6 hours ago, liambesaw said:

Just to save you time and money, here is a direct link to print postage through eBay/PayPal including the discounts and free pickup: 

http://PayPal.com/shipnow

 

Many thanks, I'm hoping potters in different countries may be  interested to list the costs they have to pay to send their small items domestically and abroad. Min above got the idea.

The reason for the comparative figures is to understand how customers further afield view one's delivery costs compared with what they pay to receive domestically sent packages.

For example, from Min's figures, compared with those I listed, it appears it will cost twice as much to send a 6" x6" x 6" parcel from one coast of Canada to the to the other and three times as much to send it from West Canada to the UK as to send the same package from the UK to any part of Canada or the USA. That is pretty surprising, and also tells me that my postage cost to Canada will be viewed by Canadian customers as extremely reasonable, and that UK customers are likely to view  a Canadian potter's postal charge as extremely high. That seems rather unfair on the Canadian potter would would like to sell their work into the UK or other countries.

I'd love to hear from an Australian, NZ or SA potter with their postal costs?

[Min]

@oly, to get a fuller picture of the total costs I would really suggest looking into duties and brokerage fees also. I ordered a 2 piece splash pan from Bailey's in the US a few years ago, I forgot to specify how I wanted it shipped and Bailey's used a courier company, the brokerage fee was more than the splash pan. ($40-) Shipping by courier might be more convenient than a countries national post but I've always found that in Canada the brokerage fees are far more expensive than those from the national post and can add a significant cost to the total. I no longer buy anything from the US unless it can be shipped by  US Postal Service. The recipients country will dictate the taxes that will be collected also, baseline for exempt or  taxes due varies by country.

[Callie Beller Diesel]

If you're looking to compare value (as opposed to cost), consider also Etsy's recent move to encourage its sellers to move towards offering free shipping on as many things as possible. They have started charging commission on postage fees as well as on the item being sold, and they're actively penalizing people in the search algorithms if they don't offer free shipping or other similar discounts.  They are heavily encouraging sellers to incorporate some or all of the shipping costs into the sale price of the item, citing that buyers have said that they'd rather pay for a $40 item with free shipping than a $25 item with $15 shipping. 

If you choose to embrace an online business model in whole or in part, shipping is an expense that is more than logical to include in your base cost of making and selling an item. And if you're looking at international markets, you also have to take into account exchange rate. 

If you purchase a mug from me in person at a sale, I charge $40 CAD. I am not the most expensive person in my market, but I'm not on the low end either. I am currently changing my online online price for the same mug to ship in Canada to $60 with free shipping (it's the $18 or so business rate plus $2 for the packing supplies). I offer a coupon code for local pickup that takes the price back down to $40.  We'll see how this works. 

To ship to the US, the same $60 CAD plus an additional $10 CAD to cover the additional post (based on shipping from Calgary to somewhere in Texas, as far away as I could get) works out to about $45 USD plus $7.50 USD. At that point, the shipping costs are more in line with what a US customer might expect, and because of the exchange rate, my prices appear pretty reasonable if I'm comparing to artists making work in a similar vein.

[Chilly]

Interesting question @oly.

I've always wondered about the shipping costs from China, HK etc.  Lots of items on eBay for 99p, including shipping.  If the seller pays for postage in their country, who foots the bill for the "final mile" as our Post Office call it.  The cheapest stamp in the UK is 58p for an A5  letter weighing 100g or less.

[neilestrick]

I look at shipping costs from online sales a little differently than most, in that I don't worry about it too much. Everywhere else I sell- galleries or art fairs- charge me to sell the work, either a percentage of the sale, or a booth fee.  So if I lose a couple bucks in shipping costs off a $32 mug that I sold online, I'm still coming out ahead of where I would be from the other sales outlets. So I set the shipping to be fairly accurate, but I don't worry about whether or not I'm covering 100% of my costs. Plus I know that I'll come out ahead on some things and behind on others, and it usually averages out pretty good. There's a big cost difference between shipping to the next state versus shipping to the other end of the country, and it's impossible to price all that out accurately ahead of time. Plus it's really difficult to accurately estimate shipments with multiple pots in them. Order for a lidded jar, 2 mugs and a platter......???

[PottaFella]

47 minutes ago, neilestrick said:

I look at shipping costs from online sales a little differently than most, in that I don't worry about it too much. Everywhere else I sell- galleries or art fairs- charge me to sell the work, either a percentage of the sale, or a booth fee.  So if I lose a couple bucks in shipping costs off a $32 mug that I sold online, I'm still coming out ahead of where I would be from the other sales outlets. So I set the shipping to be fairly accurate, but I don't worry about whether or not I'm covering 100% of my costs. Plus I know that I'll come out ahead on some things and behind on others, and it usually averages out pretty good. There's a big cost difference between shipping to the next state versus shipping to the other end of the country, and it's impossible to price all that out accurately ahead of time. Plus it's really difficult to accurately estimate shipments with multiple pots in them. Order for a lidded jar, 2 mugs and a platter......???

Understood but the shipping costs do become a concern when trying to ship (and advertise) a mug abroad where the shipping might equal or even exceed the cost of the mug.  If one can get the shipping cost to appear fair or equal to domestic shipping cost within the country your selling into, then a customer can make a judgement based on the aesthetics of the pot, unswayed by shipping costs.

I guess the size of the markets makes a big difference, I'm keen to sell into North America with a population of 400 million, and so I really want my shipping costs to look as reasonable as possible.  I guess selling into our UK market of 60 million may not be such a draw to American potters?  

[neilestrick]

39 minutes ago, oly said:

Understood but the shipping costs do become a concern when trying to ship (and advertise) a mug abroad where the shipping might equal or even exceed the cost of the mug.  If one can get the shipping cost to appear fair or equal to domestic shipping cost within the country your selling into, then a customer can make a judgement based on the aesthetics of the pot, unswayed by shipping costs.

I guess the size of the markets makes a big difference, I'm keen to sell into North America with a population of 400 million, and so I really want my shipping costs to look as reasonable as possible.  I guess selling into our UK market of 60 million may not be such a draw to American potters?  

I don't do international shipping, unless someone begs me to. The last time I did it I spent half the day getting quotes and figuring out the paperwork. Maybe it's easier now. If I were doing international shipping, I would definitely pay more attention to it than I do for domestic shipments.

[PottaFella]

2 hours ago, neilestrick said:

I don't do international shipping, unless someone begs me to. The last time I did it I spent half the day getting quotes and figuring out the paperwork. Maybe it's easier now. If I were doing international shipping, I would definitely pay more attention to it than I do for domestic shipments.

Well this is partly why I am trying to get information together, because within certain limits International need not be too difficult – sure there can be size and weight constraints if one wants to keep it manageable.

To give an idea, from UK to N. America, Tracked & Signed (5-7 working days) with £250 compensation for loss or damage up to 10" x 10" x15"  is  £23.50  (US$30)  (CAD$ 39).  That could take a nice 10" decorative jug or vase with plenty of protective padding.  So, if one knew there was or could establish, a market abroad and work is valuable/desirable enough to justify the postage cost, it gives some parameters to work to.  Anything above that size (here in UK) means other methods and can get too pricey and also tricky with insurance.

[Mark C.]

I ship about 40-60 boxes a year out with pots and other items. My go to is always UPS-I love the tracking system. The mail (edited - very poor) in comparison -really bad tracking system.

Yes I could use my PayPal /ebay but that also is pale in comparison to UPS. A few years ago I sold some photo stuff (lens and camera bodies and underwater housings)for about 8k and sent plenty a box via E-bay but so I know that system well. My mail carriers are always changing and late is the only thing thats constant.

I'm a brown fan as it works so well for me at this location in a rural setting. I know my driver the stuff is behind the gate and not on the street or waiting to see if and when the postal carrier will or will not show up.To say the the post office delivery here goes smooth is a far stretch of the truth.Its more like a kite with the string cut on a windy day. No telling whats up with them.I have only had to confront my postmaster 4 times in the last 45 years and its always been we will try harder and I had no idea the carrier would do that.

The last postmaster locked himself in his office and the nut patrol had to take him away.

Must be a real high pressure job with all those packages and junk mail constantly coming in-who knew that they come everyday without let up.

Zero issues with UPS

If I ship international which is rare-(last year shipped 4 mugs to New Zealand  for 101$ shipping fees.)  its usually the  post office.

I turned down several Canadian orders just to much hassle .

I'm not looking for more shipping business -I want less.The idea for me is simplify and the post office does not fit that model for me.From the top down it's not like it used to be. I has a great carrier for 30 plus years and now its a new kid every month making all the learn curve mistakes with our stuff. No thanks on adding pottery to that mix. Rant over on the PO..

 

 

[liambesaw]

You can use that PayPal link for commercial UPS rates too, might even be better discount than you get through UPS! Worth checking anyway

[DirtRoads]

10 minutes ago, Mark C. said:

 

The last postmaster locked himself in his office and the nut patrol had to take him away.

 

^ LOL

I don't ship pottery but I do ship jewelry.  I exclusively use       Priority Mail Small Box Flat Rate  Costs $7.2.  99% of my orders fit in the small flat box and if under $50, I charge $7.95 for shipping.    The medium box is $13.65.  I get constant shipping updates.   I used Priority Mail in my previous internet business that did over $500K a year with no problems.   I think we had one package come up missing. 

One advantage of using Priority Mail are the free boxes.  You get online and have cases delivered to you for free.

 

[Mark C.]

27 minutes ago, liambesaw said:

You can use that PayPal link for commercial UPS rates too, might even be better discount than you get through UPS! Worth checking anyway

I checked into that-my discount is 40% now  with UPS .paypal was less as I accidentally signed up for it a few years ago and it was a bit of a hassle to get it switched back to what I have now as it was less a deal than what I have.

I must add I hate paypal fees.They get you coming and going.

I do ship in the flat rate USPS boxes-usualy tools/power and clay to Hawaii when kiln building or doing workshops-thats the cheapest to Hawaii. As all UPS is airfreight to there.

[Rae Reich]

I just sent via USPS a 13.5# box insured for $300 and signed for. It was $49 from CA to MO, ground rates 5-7 days.

Not sure which company now sends me a photo with their tracking of my purchases. It shows the package I'm expecting sitting on my porch. Only problem last time was that it wasn't my porch! Don't know how it could have been resolved if, in the middle of my furious message to the company, my neighbor hadn't brought it over. The deliverers transposed the address numbers.

[dhPotter]

Yesterday, via USPS, I sent a 10"x16" bubble mailer to BC Canada. The weight was 7.20 ounces. Cost was $10 for the First Class International Service delivery plus $2.19 for the mailer. USPS could not say when it will arrive in BC but the clerk said perhaps within 3 weeks. This was my first international shipment. I rarely ship anything out, anywhere.

[PottaFella]

59 minutes ago, dhPotter said:

Yesterday, via USPS, I sent a 10"x16" bubble mailer to BC Canada. The weight was 7.20 ounces. Cost was $10 for the First Class International Service delivery plus $2.19 for the mailer. USPS could not say when it will arrive in BC but the clerk said perhaps within 3 weeks. This was my first international shipment. I rarely ship anything out, anywhere.

I always use tracked/signed service from here in the UK to everywhere, I don't want to let my customers down, plus I don't want a bad review because of a failed shipment. The one time I sort of had a problem, I had entered the tracking number wrongly for the customer - meaning neither of us were tracking the parcel correctly. After that I contacted Royal Mail and they actually increased the type size/boldness of the tracking numbers on the Post Office receipts.