Custom Single-Page Underglaze Transfer?

[Ben xyz]

Curious to hear if anyone knows of a company that would do an affordable single-page custom underglaze 11”x17” sheet (cone 6)? Had hoped it would be just a printout from a printer that is equipped to use underglazes (as inks), but I keep hearing that a metal  plate and silkscreen are necessary. Is that always the case? I would guess the printer would have to accommodate a lighter rice paper-type stock as well. Thanks!

[neilestrick]

I know there are places that can use printers for ceramic decals, but I don't know of anyone who does underglazes transfers that way.

[Ben xyz]

For some reason, I had thought I had read somewhere that a home printer equipped with underglaze pigments could do the job, but perhaps it was just wishful thinking. Thanks for your response, Neil. Will need to dig a little deeper.

[oldlady]

what kind of decal are you looking for?   if it is a single use, you can use underglaze to paint a picture and do it on newsprint.   once the thing is dry, you just put it in place and wet the back.  Kim Kirchman who teaches at st petersburg college in florida does beautiful work that way.   if you look at one of my albums, the one with the red trumpet vines, i describe how she demonstrated the technique.  click on my avatar and look for albums.

i  just checked and found that the photos are gone, no numbering and i have no idea how to fix this, it takes a computer expert.

Edited November 25, 2022 by oldlady

[Ben xyz]

Will check out Kim Kirchman’s work - thanks oldlady. I noticed a person (at the studio I belong to) doing the method of transfer with newspaper, but results became splotchy at best (which is fine if that’s the effect one wants). I think I may have found some transfer paper especially designed for this (black only for laser printers) that may work. Can then scan and print (I think). The images I’m starting with are fairly crisp, so the process needs to be pretty exacting.

Will still experiment with underglazes and try to trace the images I have onto newspaper, as well as rice paper. Thanks for your input.

Sorry to hear your images disappeared - tech support…The pieces sound nice!

[PeterH]

Googled across this image transfer technique. It uses a laser-printed image to produce a one-time transfer "plate" needing to be inked up.
How to Create an Underglaze Transfer using a Photocopy , Our Halloween Project
https://www.baileypottery.com/blog/post/print-out-photocopy-transfer-in-halloween-style.html

PS Sorry @oldlady's image transfer pics are gone. Some tiny snippets of Kim Kirchman’s work

30 second video of her painting an image https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVNuEJU5uQ8

A still of a different  image being pulled, looking pretty crisp https://www.instagram.com/p/CRMUaH2DBQ8/

Low resolution video of an image transfer at 7:38ish in https://youtu.be/-txcJjLjQZ0?t=421

 

[oldlady]

thank you peter!   sorry to hear the pics are gone.  i still have the originals but i guess that over time, things just get trashed.   found a youtube of kim and just sat here, hungry and cold, to watch 40 minutes in which she showed how she builds her striking pieces.  she mentioned several other videos  in the series so i am going to search for them.   it is finally time for breakfast and turning up the thermostat

thank you for finding more info, ii watched the other pieces you listed,   still hungry, going to eat now.  thank you again,   11:40 am, breakfast or lunch?

 

 

 

[Callie Beller Diesel]

If you want someone else to make transfers for you, there’s usually a setup fee, so only getting one sheet isn’t usually cost effective. The price gets more reasonable if you want multiple sheets. Forage Studios does have her printer back up and running, and Mariko does small batches of water slide decals for artists for a very reasonable price. But that’s overglaze, not underglaze. 

So much of it depends on the kind of image you want to transfer. Is it a logo, or a photograph with fine detail? Is it one colour or more than one?

[Callie Beller Diesel]

14 hours ago, Ben xyz said:

home printer equipped with underglaze pigments

Kinda. 

There is a company that sells equipment to make OVERglaze or water slide decals. The printers they use technically can be obtained at Office Depot, but they’re the high end ones. The company sells the printers and makes the modified ink cartridges. But they’re $$$$. 

[Babs]

If hand building, you could monoprint onto flat clay using a silk screen. Proper registration would get you crisp results.

[Ben xyz]

3 hours ago, Callie Beller Diesel said:

If you want someone else to make transfers for you, there’s usually a setup fee, so only getting one sheet isn’t usually cost effective. The price gets more reasonable if you want multiple sheets. Forage Studios does have her printer back up and running, and Mariko does small batches of water slide decals for artists for a very reasonable price. But that’s overglaze, not underglaze. 

So much of it depends on the kind of image you want to transfer. Is it a logo, or a photograph with fine detail? Is it one colour or more than one?

It’s hi-contrast line art taken from an old advertisement, one color. Have ordered underglaze decal sheets in the past, but likely they were silkscreened onto the tissue paper. Perhaps I need to research screening processes to make this happen. Since it will be a one-off, had been hoping for an easier solution. Thanks for Mariko’s info - good to have if I end up going with an overglaze decal in the future.

[Babs]

16 minutes ago, Ben xyz said:

It’s hi-contrast line art taken from an old advertisement, one color. Have ordered underglaze decal sheets in the past, but likely they were silkscreened onto the tissue paper. Perhaps I need to research screening processes to make this happen. Since it will be a one-off, had been hoping for an easier solution. Thanks for Mariko’s info - good to have if I end up going with an overglaze decal in the future.

A one of! How valuable is your time?

I've noticed ythat newspaper print does transfer onto clay, Could you print, folk will know what printer inks work best, a copy of your image, place on clay, dampen and roll, remove,  then paint it with underglazes?

Just a thought.

[Ben xyz]

Sure thing, Babs. It will be one color line art, similar in complexity to the illustrations provided below (low-rez posted here). Thanks!

[High Bridge Pottery]

You can get reasonable results using laser printer, underglaze/oxide mixed with linseed oil and a gum arabic solution.

 

[Ben xyz]

Thanks HBP - time to experiment! It might be even be easier when working with a high contrast line art image.

[Babs]

you can print silk screen stencils directly from computer , think you need inkjet p for this.

[Callie Beller Diesel]

@Ben xyz the good news is, that kind of image is ideal for printing. Line work is easier to transfer than something with shading or gradations. 

If using that style of image in your work is a regular thing, even if you only want the one particular image for a single project, the startup equipment isn’t too involved. You need a soft-yet-firm rib to push ink, a silkscreen like from ezprint or speedball, something to print on (newsprint, rice paper, gelli plate), and some underglaze. 

The artist that Babs mentioned, Shauna Pincus, does offer a VERY affordable online workshop on getting set up to do some silk screen printing with a gelli plate. The a gelli plate is a gelatin based thinger (technical term, there) that has the advantage of being able to conform to curved or irregular surfaces. It seems to give a really nice, sharp transfer. You can buy gelli plates, or make your own out of gelatine and I think glycerine, but I don’t have the recipe handy. Here’s the link to her course if you’re interested. 

If you’ve done any silk screening or have used an ez print screen before, Shauna does have a few reels on her IG feed at the moment that give a bit more insight into how she does it. In reading some of the comments on them, I notice that she’s planning some kind of workshop for the new year, but hasn’t sorted out all the details. I did find a mention that she does use underglaze as her ink, but leaves it out to dry a bit so it thickens into the right consistency. 

[oldlady]

just to be clear, if someone is going to print from newspaper PAPER, use a clean, never touched pad of paper not some printed stories already inked onto the paper by the newspaper presses.  that paper is called newsprint   BUT it has not been inked.

[Ben xyz]

14 hours ago, Callie Beller Diesel said:

@Ben xyz the good news is, that kind of image is ideal for printing. Line work is easier to transfer than something with shading or gradations. 

If using that style of image in your work is a regular thing, even if you only want the one particular image for a single project, the startup equipment isn’t too involved. You need a soft-yet-firm rib to push ink, a silkscreen like from ezprint or speedball, something to print on (newsprint, rice paper, gelli plate), and some underglaze. 

The artist that Babs mentioned, Shauna Pincus, does offer a VERY affordable online workshop on getting set up to do some silk screen printing with a gelli plate. The a gelli plate is a gelatin based thinger (technical term, there) that has the advantage of being able to conform to curved or irregular surfaces. It seems to give a really nice, sharp transfer. You can buy gelli plates, or make your own out of gelatine and I think glycerine, but I don’t have the recipe handy. Here’s the link to her course if you’re interested. 

If you’ve done any silk screening or have used an ez print screen before, Shauna does have a few reels on her IG feed at the moment that give a bit more insight into how she does it. In reading some of the comments on them, I notice that she’s planning some kind of workshop for the new year, but hasn’t sorted out all the details. I did find a mention that she does use underglaze as her ink, but leaves it out to dry a bit so it thickens into the right consistency. 

Thanks for the link - definitely reasonable and will likely take the online pre-recorded class (though a new workshop sounds great too). Have done some silkscreen in college (eons ago), but the gelli plate is all new to me. I have seen another potter thickening up her underglazes by drying them out somewhat and using them like printers inks. 

[Min]

Quick gelli plate and silkscreen process, with and without paper. 

Gelli plates don't contain gelatin but you can make your own gel plate using gelatin, don't know how well / long homemade gel plates last for. 

1 - gelli plate dusted with cornstarch (gelli plates come in different sizes, I'ld get one just big enough for what you want to screen) 

2 - silkscreen in place (can get custom made ones or stock ones, available from a few makers not just EZscreen, can also buy a blank screen and burn it yourself)

3 - Xiem rib used with thick underglaze. Either let it thicken up on it's own or thicken with Mayco silkscreen medium/powder. I tried the Mayco medium I think it's probably CMC, I prefer to just let it thicken on its own. Needs to be almost peanut butter thick.

If you use a gelli plate it needs to be applied to the pot (or vice versa) quickly while the underglaze is still wet. Either lift up the gelli plate and press it onto the pot or roll the pot across the gelli plate.

With paper instead of gelli-

1 - Rice paper (I buy from Sanbao but other places sell it too) rough side up, no cornstarch

2 - tape the screen down, same underglaze process 

Can also screen right onto pots if the screen isn't too large to be awkward. I find the paper is easier to apply to rounded forms.

  

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Min
added a link

[Ben xyz]

6 hours ago, Min said:

Quick gelli plate and silkscreen process, with and without paper. 

Gelli plates don't contain gelatin but you can make your own gel plate using gelatin, don't know how well / long homemade gel plates last for. 

1 - gelli plate dusted with cornstarch (gelli plates come in different sizes, I'ld get one just big enough for what you want to screen) 

2 - silkscreen in place (can get custom made ones or stock ones, available from a few makers not just EZscreen, can also buy a blank screen and burn it yourself)

3 - Xiem rib used with thick underglaze. Either let it thicken up on it's own or thicken with Mayco silkscreen medium/powder. I tried the Mayco medium I think it's probably CMC, I prefer to just let it thicken on its own. Needs to be almost peanut butter thick.

If you use a gelli plate it needs to be applied to the pot (or vice versa) quickly while the underglaze is still wet. Either lift up the gelli plate and press it onto the pot or roll the pot across the gelli plate.

With paper instead of gelli-

1 - Rice paper (I buy from Sanbao but other places sell it too) rough side up, no cornstarch

2 - tape the screen down, same underglaze process 

Can also screen right onto pots if the screen isn't too large to be awkward. I find the paper is easier to apply to rounded forms.

  

 

 

Fantastic Min - VERY informative! Answered a lot of questions I had.

[bny]

Tissue transfer ... Prepare a silk screen or start experimenting with the screens sold for earring decoration on polymer clay.  Use "half-ripe" xuan paper available in cut sheet or roll form, sold for China calligraphy practice, currently under $US30 for a 35 cm x 100 m roll.  "Raw" xuan works but often with more gaps, call it rustic.  "Full ripe" paper gave poor results in a brief try.  Disused sewing pattern paper can also work.  Unprinted cut sheet transfer paper from transfer suppliers is better but more costly.  Transfer tissue best for hot oil ink intaglio process (Potclays, maybe unavailable now) was not good for this technique.  Use glaze or underglaze dried down to around toothpaste to peanut butter consistency.  I feel that adding a little gum arabic solution helps transfer behavior.  I blue tape the paper and screen to a commercial glazed tile, and use a plastic scraper (putty knife) to apply the ink directly.  I have good results with old Speedball earthenware glazes (neglected in jars for 6 years), a couple of new Sax underglazes dried down, and a couple of old Coyote high fire underglazes.  Some Mayco Stroke and Coat colors have done ok.

[Ben xyz]

Thanks for the input about the materials you've had success with, bny. Feeling more confident about moving forward with the process.

[bny]

Left example is one of Mayco Stroke and Coat purples, right is Speedball purple, both with Mayco Crystal Clear overglaze.  62 mm diameter after firing.  Colors were dried down, and modified with gum arabic solution as previously mentioned.  Ready patterned screens were probably Keoker.  "Half-ripe" xuan roll paper.  I sponge on the dried transfer print, then brush with a soap solution, and burnish with a wooden tool before peeling.  Soap solution brushing is a habit from earlier hot oil/intaglio fine line work with soap-sized tissue (soap sizing the tissue before printing is necessary there, but counterproductive for aqueous glazes), and may not be essential.  Look for the color to go more white under the paper surface as a partial clue to adhered transfer, not as reliable an indication as with commercial transfers, but useful.  Clay Planet Low Fire White cone 04 bisque then 04 or 06 glaze.  I have also had good results on Texas Blackjack clay (dark gray in the block, fires white).  Note how the Mayco purple does not develop as strong a line density, but gives a pleasantly softened line under the clear glaze.

[oldlady]

i can't imagine why you use soap at all.   just paper and stroke & coat works fine.   i use the SC33 fruit of the vine color for a dark purple.  the light lavender you show on the first example is very nice, what color is it?