Bam2015 Posted January 10, 2020 Report Share Posted January 10, 2020 Hi All, Doing some research for a project and wondering if anyone can provide insight please. How are class or workshop instructors in private or community studios typically paid? Is it typically a percent of revenue generated from the class or workshop, an hourly rate, or some other method? I'm am not referring to instructors who are employed by the studio but rather those who teach a class or workshop here and there. And maybe there isn't a standard or a "typical" method to compensate? Regarding travel and/or lodging, does the studio pick up or reimburse for any travel or lodging? Thank you, Betty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulk Posted January 10, 2020 Report Share Posted January 10, 2020 Good question! In the case where recital/class/workshop raises funds for a scholarship or some other philanthropic cause, the host typically provides lodging and a few meals, if that, the artists being in "give-back" mode, as it were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Posted January 10, 2020 Report Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 hours ago, Hulk said: Good question! In the case where recital/class/workshop raises funds for a scholarship or some other philanthropic cause, the host typically provides lodging and a few meals, if that, the artists being in "give-back" mode, as it were. well that really sucks that groups put the hurt on artist to donate. I know some artist/artisans make a good living but most I think struggle and any cause involving providing art classes/workshops should also look at the workshop or class helping to further the cause of artist themselves earn a living and continuing to give back by being a working artist. A workshop that requires travel is so many hours from prep to return. Planning, packing (often shipping something ahead) a day of travel each way and then how ever many hours conducting the class\workshop. No-one should then try to guilt them into paying for part of the cost of doing it. sorry for the rant Hulk, that just hit a nerve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulk Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 That's fine. The only recurring recital/class/workshop I know about - sole purpose is to raise scholarship funds (hence, not for profit). Ain' puttin' no hurt on anyone here - we attend and pay because we like the program's admin and have liked all the scholarship recipients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 7 hours ago, Bam2015 said: Hi All, Doing some research for a project and wondering if anyone can provide insight please. How are class or workshop instructors in private or community studios typically paid? Is it typically a percent of revenue generated from the class or workshop, an hourly rate, or some other method? I'm am not referring to instructors who are employed by the studio but rather those who teach a class or workshop here and there. And maybe there isn't a standard or a "typical" method to compensate? Regarding travel and/or lodging, does the studio pick up or reimburse for any travel or lodging? Thank you, Betty Some of the more prominent post their terms right on their website. Several I know figure their time, travel and per diem and then the inviting studios resell the appropriate number of seats. Often to break even, sometimes at a loss as a benefit to their members, and occasionally there are providers that are in the business to make a profit and have large well equipped facilities and can sell many seats for each event. If one can stay booked consistently it can be quite profitable as the majority of expenses are their time. Of course being away from home for days, hotels and restaurants gets old in a hurry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam2015 Posted January 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 I apologize, not sure I did a very good job of asking the question because it seems to have taken a turn in a different direction. I am interested to find out how much, or how, an instructor is compensated in either a private or community studio for teaching for example a six session pottery class or a workshop, not someone who is donating their time to a non-profit or philanthropic organization. Rather, a working potter/artist/instructor who either makes their living off of or supplementing their income with teaching. I'm assuming there are folks who are active on this forum who either teach or own a studio who have this knowledge. I am trying to gather this info for a project and in hopes of incorporating it into a business plan. Thank you, Betty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta12 Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 31 minutes ago, Bam2015 said: I apologize, not sure I did a very good job of asking the question because it seems to have taken a turn in a different direction. I am interested to find out how much, or how, an instructor is compensated in either a private or community studio for teaching for example a six session pottery class or a workshop, not someone who is donating their time to a non-profit or philanthropic organization. Rather, a working potter/artist/instructor who either makes their living off of or supplementing their income with teaching. I'm assuming there are folks who are active on this forum who either teach or own a studio who have this knowledge. I am trying to gather this info for a project and in hopes of incorporating it into a business plan. Thank you, Betty In my experience, both as being a teacher and being a student, it varies widely. For a few of the small local gigs I have had, I set the fee, paid rent for the space and collected the money. My fee depended upon what I had to do and provide. Provide pieces for the student to work on, or glaze or build from scratch. I have taken a number of workshops and they have been at art camps, private galleries, art centers. Most of the instructors I have had are compensated for travel, had housing and meals provided as well as a salary. Some are able to bring their families for a mini vacation. Check out Arrowmont, Plinth Gallery, Penland, ARAC, Idlywylld, MISSA. Maybe that will give you an idea of fees and salary. Roberta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcia Selsor Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 I get a variety of teaching fees. usually I get travel, lodging and food . I am encouraged to bring pieces for sale to help enhance my fees. Get $500/day for a 2 day workshop. If that is too difficult for a struggling group, I can negotiate. I am about to teach a workshop in San Antonio and have been prepping for it for two weeks, wrote a very specific handout so they bring pieces ready to fire in 4 different processes. For a week long class it can also be 1000 for the week. It really depends on what the workshop entails, food and lodging, etc. Marcia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 1 hour ago, Bam2015 said: I apologize, not sure I did a very good job of asking the question because it seems to have taken a turn in a different direction. I am interested to find out how much, or how, an instructor is compensated in either a private or community studio for teaching for example a six session pottery class or a workshop, not someone who is donating their time to a non-profit or philanthropic organization. Rather, a working potter/artist/instructor who either makes their living off of or supplementing their income with teaching. I'm assuming there are folks who are active on this forum who either teach or own a studio who have this knowledge. I am trying to gather this info for a project and in hopes of incorporating it into a business plan. Thank you, Betty I have been a college level instructor and many of the studios here pay similarly in calculation but significantly at a lower rate than a college. Generally by the contact hour with a minimum number of students to offset the instructors salary and a maximum class size to limit the instructor workload within reason. A ten week course that meets once per week for three hours probably gets most instructors 1k - 2k depending upon competition. Generally not a whole bunch of money actually. It Probably equates to let’s say 35.00 - 75.00 per contact hour and often handled as a contract day labor type situation with respect to insurance and benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 14 hours ago, Hulk said: That's fine. The only recurring recital/class/workshop I know about - sole purpose is to raise scholarship funds (hence, not for profit). Ain' puttin' no hurt on anyone here - we attend and pay because we like the program's admin and have liked all the scholarship recipients. And you were really right and I was wrong. It's up to the artist to stand firm on their rate if they need to do so to make a living and it's not fair of me to blame a charitable organizer for trying to maximize the haul for their cause. If I had not just posted a knee ######## reaction to ur post I would have seen that. It's really not much different than part timers selling pots for cheap and full timers selling at a rate that makes sense to their businesses. They both have a right to do what they want within their own realities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEP Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 From a person who used to teach in a community center setting ... I got $25/hr for contact hours only. The classes were officially 2.5 hours long, which means it doesn’t add up to a substantial income. I love teaching so that was my payoff. But during those years, my pottery studio business rounded into a full-time income business. And when I saw that happening, the teaching was the first thing I quit. The time commitment of teaching (which requires way more than the contact hours), plus the inflexible schedule, were clearly reducing my income, not bolstering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulk Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 Thank you Stephen! Intended "In the case..." to qualify the remarks that followed ...which, while related to the op's question, probably not helpful. Glad to see specific/helpful info has been offered by forum regulars that have the experience. As for part time/hobby potter pricing, that really resonates! My work may never raise a blip on local potters' radar; however, pricing within the local "ballpark" is an important consideration for me. This year I plan to participate in the Fall "Open Studios" event, and a few other public sales type events, where my pricing will be in that ballpark, just because that seems right to me. Last year I donated more work to sales/auctions to benefit non-profits than I sold. This year I expect to donate much more work, and sell more as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 For teaching at a community studio I would expect the pay to be $20-30 per contact hour. Actual work time will be another hour per week on top of that, though, so the pay is not great. At many studios is also includes studio access outside of class time, which is a big draw for a lot of people. Teaching a one day special workshop is totally different. I charge $350 for 6 hours. That's what I need to make to justify closing up the shop for the day. I can usually sell some pots during the workshop, too, so I can usually end up at $75/hr or more by the end. Big time famous people may charge $500-$1000 per day. The host typically pays for travel costs, lodging, meals, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denice Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 I was offered a job to teach sculpture at a city art facility, they told me it paid minimum wage. The studio was about 20 miles from my home and in a bad neighborhood, I told them that minimum wage wouldn't hardly pay for my gas. They just shrugged their shoulders and said that is all they pay, so I shrugged my shoulders and said I am not interested. I wasn't looking for a job they approached me. My husband was glad I turned it down a lot of gang killings even one in the studio's parking lot. Denice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callie Beller Diesel Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 So interestingly enough, there is an organization in Canada called CARFAC that advocates for artists. It’s a good resource for Canadian artists in regard to copyright information, how to ship work across the border, and among other things, fees of all kinds. Their fee schedule is the recommended minimum rate in Canada. There are no rules that require these recommended rates to be adhered to, but some institutions require it within their mandates. CARFAC encourages artists to negotiate for more. Here is a copy and pasted section from their documents that talk about the recommended rates for leading workshops and the logic behind it. C.2.0 • Presentation and Consultation fees Presentations include giving a lecture about an artist’s own work or any area of expertise associated with the work or one’s life as an artist; participating on a panel, roundtable, or informal Q&A; leading workshops or tours; speaking to school groups, and so on. It should be noted that while the speaking engagement may be well under four hours, the overall event that the artist is asked to attend is often much longer, and these kinds of presentations often take a significant amount of time to prepare, and should therefore not be reduced to an hourly rate. Consultation means the giving of advice, input, or opinions that might be associated with project development, exhibitions, or commissions concerning the artist’s own production, or participation in a consultative process concerned with, for example, policy development in the cultural arena. Flat rate per half day, under 4 hours $316 Flat rate per day, over 4 hours $557 Please note these amounts are in Canadian dollars. These are also workshop or artist talk rates, not suggestions for ongoing courses. There are obviously structural differences in the US, but it could be an interesting starting point for a research project. More information can be found at https://www.carfac.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam2015 Posted January 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Thank you everyone for your responses. I assumed that compensation would be all over the place. This is a good info, a good starting place. Betty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 2 hours ago, Bam2015 said: Thank you everyone for your responses. I assumed that compensation would be all over the place. This is a good info, a good starting place. Betty You may actually close in on some sort of uniformity adding all the potential benefits. For instance in the studio case allowing teachers to use the studio is a benefit and likely allows for a lessor hourly rate. Just worth a mention, I think as the latent values may be significant enough to account for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcia Selsor Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Another consideration may be the type pf weekend workshop. For example . 35 years ago, Ruday Autio who was very famous, had a minimum of $1000 per day for demo only. He was a wonderful entertainer while he worked and could easily fill a room of 50-100 attendees. Aside from compensation, does anyone have opinions on demo only type of workshops compared to hands on? I have done both. When I taught for Potter Council events it was usually 4-5 artists demonstrating. Individual sessions held 30-50 people and were repetitive so one could try to schedule all the demos over 2 days. I usually do hands on when teaching alternative firing processes because people bring work to fire. Just interested to hear people's opinions. Marcia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristen Kieffer Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Hello all, I have an article out in the latest issue of CM (Feb 2020, pp. 40-44) that speaks exactly to this thread and discussion~ Workshop Logistics: Contract Norms & Honorarium Rates. Kieffer Workshop Logistics 2020 CM.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam2015 Posted January 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Kristen, how timely, thank you for sharing the article! I am a fan of your work, it's beautiful. Betty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callie Beller Diesel Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Welcome to the forum @Kristen Kieffer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristen Kieffer Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 Thank you, Betty & Callie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roberta12 Posted January 13, 2020 Report Share Posted January 13, 2020 @Kristen Kieffer Thank you for a great article. I have admired your work, listened to you at NCECA, and hope one day to meet you in person. Roberta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristen Kieffer Posted January 13, 2020 Report Share Posted January 13, 2020 Thank you, Roberta12! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcia Selsor Posted January 13, 2020 Report Share Posted January 13, 2020 Admire your work, Kristen. Welcome to the forum. Great article in CM. I need to review my costs to do workshops Haven't raised the rate in years Much food for thought there Neil also has an article in the recent issue on transporting work Good article, Neil! Marcia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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