ronfire Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 I recently purchased a used Pacifica gt500 wheel. I replaced the top bearing as it was getting lose and noisy, the wheel turns flat with with no wobble. My problem is I can not throw anything larger than a mug and keep a centre. Bottom of items end up uneven, verticals end up higher on ones area, I trim and again it gets uneven. I have not had this issue on my old Estrin wheel and am at a loss. Just yesterday I broke 1 belt so I have ordered 4 new ones. Could the old belts be elastic like and start a speed pulse in the wheel? Would inconsistent wheel speed cause this problem. The wheel head is tight with no play, top bearing is new and the bottom one was fine and did not require replacing.The wheel appears to run true and flat with a tool just touching the wheel. Even a wheel head that was slightly out should not create this problem, it is like the bat will shift slightly but they are tight fit and it does it with all the bats. Hope the new belts fix the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 If the belts were slipping that could definitely cause problems. If everything else is running true, that's about the only possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulk Posted August 30, 2019 Report Share Posted August 30, 2019 Hi Ron, Any chance the clay is moving on you? I still have a clay ball move on me - haven't been throwing very long - but have cut down on the problem considerable, while it's nice to center up a mound more vertical than horizontal, if there isn't sufficient grip to the bat, the ball will move a bit, which is very frustrating, hence I'll push it out until "experience" tells me it ain't gonna move, which varies depending which bat it is (plastic holds worst, plaster is a hungry vampire). When the clay is really stuck and well wedged up, centering can be fun! The other thing that helps me is taking the time to cone up/down several times - one can almost feel when the clay is fully swirled out and ready to be opened; for sure you can tell when it's not ready, there's ropy lumps, bumps, it won't center up (yet), wobbly, bobbly, mean old... Any road, hope it sorts out for you soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronfire Posted August 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2019 I sure hope the belt is the issue. I find it will not hold a tension so it looks like it might be it. I use wood bats that are tight on the wheel and have always held the clay well or just lets go. I have been throwing for around 5 years and have never had an issue like this. . I contacted Laguna to find out information on the wheel and they have never herd of the gt500 They purchased the buisness in 94 and said it must be a very old wheel. I did not ask them about my issue, should have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CactusPots Posted September 1, 2019 Report Share Posted September 1, 2019 Does the driven pulley have individual grooves for the belts, or is the pulley look like it's made for a V belt? Use a round bubble level to insure the wheel head is level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted September 2, 2019 Report Share Posted September 2, 2019 The wheel does not need to be level. Your hands will pull evenly with the wheel head regardless of how level it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronfire Posted September 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2019 Installed the new belts and it seams to be better, have to throw some more to see. The new belts are clear instead of black like the old ones. The wheel does not slip now but the belts squeak a lot from the motor pulley. I tightened the belts but it did not seam to make a difference, they sure stretched after the first run. The motor was a little out of line in relation to the belt, I aligned the motor square in to the belts and is a little better but still squeaks. The squeak is there when the wheel is running with no load so it is not a slippage issue. Does anyone use belt dressing spray on them like you do on the vehicle belts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CactusPots Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 On 9/1/2019 at 7:15 PM, neilestrick said: The wheel does not need to be level. Your hands will pull evenly with the wheel head regardless of how level it is. I'm having trouble with this. If the wheel head is not level, then the foot of the pot is not going to be even with the base of the pot, as I'm picturing this. You can pull the walls straight and level the rim, but you'll have to trim the foot level, it won't be on the same plane as the rim. Change my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liambesaw Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 minute ago, CactusPots said: I'm having trouble with this. If the wheel head is not level, then the foot of the pot is not going to be even with the base of the pot, as I'm picturing this. You can pull the walls straight and level the rim, but you'll have to trim the foot level, it won't be on the same plane as the rim. Change my mind. I had a lot more issues with level ground when I used a 4 footed wheel (shimpo rk2), but since switching to a tripod wheel I haven't really noticed. My wheel is about half an inch cockeyed, but so is my entire shed, so my chAir is cockeyed etc. And actually when I contacted shimpo about my old wheel having a head wobble, their first suggestion was to level the wheel. That worked, wobble gone. I think especially with these old cone ring drive ones it's more important than a belt drive since gravity has more of a role in the cone drive. With my new belt one, i haven't noticed any difference and my pots aren't cockeyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Min Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 7 minutes ago, CactusPots said: I'm having trouble with this. If the wheel head is not level, then the foot of the pot is not going to be even with the base of the pot, as I'm picturing this. You can pull the walls straight and level the rim, but you'll have to trim the foot level, it won't be on the same plane as the rim. Change my mind. Will this do? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNKwscKjtCc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liambesaw Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 minute ago, Min said: Will this do? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNKwscKjtCc Not really a good comparison since he's throwing at an angle too. There's a difference between doing something on purpose and chasing an annoying issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 @liambesaw I think it’s pretty representative. People throw in relation to the bat or at least in a line perpendicular to the bat. I think it’s actually difficult to make it come out level, vs perpendicular to the wheel head. Same even if he needles off the rim. You will be cutting at one elevation at the same point in space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liambesaw Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 11 minutes ago, Bill Kielb said: @liambesaw I think it’s pretty representative. People throw in relation to the bat or at least in a line perpendicular to the bat. I think it’s actually difficult to make it come out level, vs perpendicular to the wheel head. Same even if he needles off the rim. You will be cutting at one elevation at the same point in space. For an old hat yes, for someone new no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Min Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 If the wheelhead rocks because the wheel is on 4 feet on an uneven surface or because the top bearing is shot that's going to cause a problem with an uneven rim. Liam, try the experiment in the video but just put the wheel slightly out of level and see how it turns out. Also, we've probably all had uneven rims when starting out, that's from a different issue though, uneven pulling of the walls. All things being equal, if you don't have wobbly rims with a level wheelhead you won't have a wobbly rim with an unlevel wheelhead as long as the wheelhead itself isn't wobbling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, liambesaw said: For an old hat yes, for someone new no. I’ll have to try but I still think it’s difficult to throw crooked, save all the other reasons for things to wobble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liambesaw Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 Like I said, I don't have issue anymore, especially since switching to my big boy. And I throw crooked every night, but when I was first starting it was an issue that magically disappeared when I leveled my shimpo. Y'all don't remember the struggle! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 16 hours ago, CactusPots said: I'm having trouble with this. If the wheel head is not level, then the foot of the pot is not going to be even with the base of the pot, as I'm picturing this. You can pull the walls straight and level the rim, but you'll have to trim the foot level, it won't be on the same plane as the rim. Change my mind. This is not possible: When you trim the top of a pot off with the needle tool, you are not cutting it level, you are cutting it parallel to the wheel head, regardless of whether or not the wheel head is level. The clay will always move in relation to the wheel head, regardless of whether or not the wheel is level. Your hands do not know where level is, either. Do not confuse the wheel being out of level with the wheel not running true. A wheel that is not running true- the wheel not being perpendicular to the shaft on which it rotates (a wobble)- can definitely cause problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liambesaw Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 That's true, my wheel was not running true because it was out of level, the way the pedal is connected to the motor (cone) that hits the ring is bizarre and fascinating but is held in place by two small Allen screws. If your rk2 is off level the pedal will shift on one side over time and the cone will be hitting the ring at an angle. Levelling the rk2 and moving the tension bar to straight fixed that permanently. My three legger has been out of level from day one and I've never had a problem. Belt drive will work at any angle, have even seen a video of someone throwing on a hubcap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark C. Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 I have never leveled a wheel in my 45 plus years. I do make sure its not rocking -my old studio floor was way out of leverl and I made 35 years worth of production on that floor with an unlevel wheel. Not sure whats all the level fuzz is about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronfire Posted September 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 The drawing is wrong because if you pull strait vertical your pot would have tapered sides . That drawing does not represent a spinning wheel. If the wheel head or shaft was bent then the drawing would be accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 2 hours ago, ronfire said: The drawing is wrong because if you pull strait vertical your pot would have tapered sides . That drawing does not represent a spinning wheel. If the wheel head or shaft was bent then the drawing would be accurate. The drawing is not accurate no matter what's going on with the wheel head. A bent shaft would not allow it to happen, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark C. Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 If the pots centers and throws well straight on wheelhead with NO BATS USED then its a bat issue. Try that first then you will know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulacollins Posted September 19, 2019 Report Share Posted September 19, 2019 Good to hear this in this thread topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronfire Posted September 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2019 The new belts solved the problem and cured the belt squeak with some spray belt dressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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