Shimpo Ringcone-Popet Pottery Wheel (Without RK Desigination)

[SmithLakeCeramics]

Hi everyone,

I am new to this site and I am interested in finding out when the RK designation was added to the Shimpo pottery wheels. I have located a wheel that appears to be in good used condition with a slight tick. The seller has described this as a bearing tick. I have researched online and found that these bearings are readily available for the RK Models and this wheel looks very similar to the Shimpo RK-2 Wheel.  

I am interested in this wheel due to its simplicity of design and the fact that it appears to be built like a tank.

I know it would be a stretch to diagnose a wheel without listening to it, but is this a common problem? If it is a bearing, the procedure appears to be straightforward and I have replaced bearings and races on cars, trucks, and trailers many times. Do bad motors present with a small tick? The wheel is about 3 hours away so I have a call in to the seller to ask questions. I guess it could also be a small flat spot on the rubber disk that the cone presses against.   

Any information or suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks

[liambesaw]

I think the RK model has been around since at least 1967 since that's the year my RK2 has stamped on it.  Bearing should be a simple replacement, can probably find an off the shelf replacement no problem. 

Who knows if it's actually a bearing though.

[SmithLakeCeramics]

Thanks for the information liambesaw. Hopefully the seller will call me and I can ask a few questions to narrow it down. If the cone can be moved away from the rubber disk, I think that would be key to ruling out the motor. The problem is the 3 hour drive to put eyes (and ears) on the wheel. I have heard that a motor replacement and finding a suitable motor is not that difficult, but as replacement parts keep adding up, the juice may just not be worth the squeeze.

Thanks again

[SmithLakeCeramics]

liambesaw,

Just out of curiosity, does your wheel have the same motor in it? I have a refrigerator in my garage that is over 60 years old that just keeps chugging along. The only thing I have done to it is replace the door gasket. I think that maybe sometimes older may be better, at least as far as the motors go.

Thanks

[liambesaw]

Mine has all original parts from what I can tell, it was purchased from a community college where it was in use for 40 years.  The bearings were probably replaced at some point but it is the original motor, and the motor will last for another 60 years I'm sure.  Things were built very well back then.

[Benzine]

I have one in my classroom, that is at least forty years old. 

As you mentioned, it runs like a tank.

I ended up taking quite a bit of it apart last year, because the old, probably original yellow splashpan/ work table broke.  I had some cracks, and the drain openings leaked, even with new plugs.  A student had wood bat fly off, which just shattered one of the sides.  (The look on their face was priceless, as I think they were expecting me to yell at them or something) 

I actually had to break off the remaining pieces, because I could not get the wheel head off, to access the bolts holding the pan on. 

The area under the pan was fairly rusted.  So I just decided to strip and repaint the whole thing, as the "Army Green" wasn't my style. 

I ended up replacing one of the bearings on the wheel head shaft.  It wasn't really worn, but it was damaged a bit when I went to remove the wheel head.   I actually had to take most of the wheel head assembly appart just to get the wheel head off the shaft.  Even now, after I cleaned and lubed everything up, it still doesn't want to come off again.  Oh well, the new paint job should last for twenty to thirty years...

[liambesaw]

18 minutes ago, Benzine said:

I have one in my classroom, that is at least forty years old. 

As you mentioned, it runs like a tank.

I ended up taking quite a bit of it apart last year, because the old, probably original yellow splashpan/ work table broke.  I had some cracks, and the drain openings leaked, even with new plugs.  A student had wood bat fly off, which just shattered one of the sides.  (The look on their face was priceless, as I think they were expecting me to yell at them or something) 

I actually had to break off the remaining pieces, because I could not get the wheel head off, to access the bolts holding the pan on. 

The area under the pan was fairly rusted.  So I just decided to strip and repaint the whole thing, as the "Army Green" wasn't my style. 

I ended up replacing one of the bearings on the wheel head shaft.  It wasn't really worn, but it was damaged a bit when I went to remove the wheel head.   I actually had to take most of the wheel head assembly appart just to get the wheel head off the shaft.  Even now, after I cleaned and lubed everything up, it still doesn't want to come off again.  Oh well, the new paint job should last for twenty to thirty years...

I replaced the allen bolt holding the wheel head on because I think the interaction between the aluminum wheelhead and whatever the bolt is made from caused it to seize.  Was a huge pain to remove like you found out and after all the torquing I did to remove it originally I was afraid it would snap the next time I tried to remove it.  I only took the wheelhead off because I had to install a splash pan.

 

[Benzine]

30 minutes ago, liambesaw said:

I replaced the allen bolt holding the wheel head on because I think the interaction between the aluminum wheelhead and whatever the bolt is made from caused it to seize.  Was a huge pain to remove like you found out and after all the torquing I did to remove it originally I was afraid it would snap the next time I tried to remove it.  I only took the wheelhead off because I had to install a splash pan.

 

I have no idea why it's on there so well, but it is!  I even used some "Anti-Seize" product on the shaft, and it still doesn't want to come off. 

There needs to be a "Wheel Puller" like tool, for wheel heads... Wheel Head Puller!

[SmithLakeCeramics]

Thanks Benzine and again Liambesaw for all the information and the vote of confidence for this particular wheel.

I will be sure and do my due diligence before I make the purchase, but it appears to be just the kind of wheel I am looking for, simple and timeless.

[Mark C.]

11 hours ago, Benzine said:

I have no idea why it's on there so well, but it is!  I even used some "Anti-Seize" product on the shaft, and it still doesn't want to come off. 

There needs to be a "Wheel Puller" like tool, for wheel heads... Wheel Head Puller!

When school is out turn wheel upside down and apply DEEP CREEP anti spray. let sit updaise down for many days reapply-let gravity do the work.

If this does not work I have the next idea . But try this easy one 1st

[liambesaw]

1 hour ago, Mark C. said:

When school is out turn wheel upside down and apply DEEP CREEP anti spray. let sit updaise down for many days reapply-let gravity do the work.

If this does mnot work I have the next idea . But try this easy one 1st

I actually used deep creep on mine, did nothing. What worked was a blow torch and a mallet.

 

[Mark C.]

darn that was my next idea for him

( What worked was a blow torch and a mallet.) a lttle heat and a thump

ok go direrctly to step two

[SmithLakeCeramics]

5 hours ago, Mark C. said:

"( What worked was a blow torch and a mallet.) a little heat and a thump"

...and a little paraffin wax. (It will flow into the joint just like solder.)

No I don't have the wheel yet but I do have an old Troybuilt Tiller that I restored, and I am presently restoring a 1954 Chevy Truck, so I am no stranger to stuck wheels, bolts, etc.

Good luck!

 

[Benzine]

9 hours ago, Mark C. said:

When school is out turn wheel upside down and apply DEEP CREEP anti spray. let sit updaise down for many days reapply-let gravity do the work.

If this does not work I have the next idea . But try this easy one 1st

 

8 hours ago, liambesaw said:

I actually used deep creep on mine, did nothing. What worked was a blow torch and a mallet.

 

 

6 hours ago, Mark C. said:

darn that was my next idea for him

( What worked was a blow torch and a mallet.) a lttle heat and a thump

ok go direrctly to step two

Haha!

 

That's for the advice you two!  Luckily, I don't need to get the wheel head off again, anytime soon.  I was just amazed that despite everything I did to get it off, and all the care I took, to *try* and make it easier to get off in the future, it is still on there!

 

Also, "Deep Creep" sounds like the name for someone, who reads obscure literature and hangs around bookstores to hit on the clientele...

[Johnmicheal]

Heat it, the aluminum head will expand better than the steel shaft. I've done it before, about to do it again, lol. Even with a healthy coat of antiseize applied it still seized. 

[SmithLakeCeramics]

Thanks Johnmicheal.

That sounds logical. When freeing bolts I would heat the bolt and area around the bolt and apply paraffin to the threads. Then I would quickly apply ice to the bolt and use vice grips to remove the bolt. I now see that due to the configuration of this wheel, my options are limited.

I picked up the wheel on Saturday (attached picture below) and I am not sure now if I am going to tackle the head right away.  I did order a 8mm T-Handle wrench for when and if I try to tackle this wheel head removal. For now the wheel seems to be running smooth except for the slight tick. Since it could just be a flat spot on the ring, I am just going to give it a while to maybe work itself out and enjoy the wheel for a while.  I am just waiting on my clay order to arrive.

PS  I see that you are located in Mentone, AL. We ate at the Wildflower Cafe in Mentone on the way back from picking up the wheel and it was really good! 

[Johnmicheal]

 

From an earlier post, these are the bearings I used to rebuild my RK

There are the 3 different sizes: 

Kit9705 6204-2NSE Nachi Bearing 20x47x14:Sealed:C3:Japan 

Kit9706 6205-2NSE Nachi Bearing 25x52x15:Sealed:C3:Japan 

Kit9703 6202-2NSE Nachi Bearing 15x35x11:Sealed:C3:Japan

[Hulk]

Those bearings should be easy to find - common in bike hubs and suspensions; the dimensions are mm, typically inside diameter, outside diameter, height (aka thickness, width).

Choosing the bearing that will last - in a particular application - aah, that can be a challenge! fwiw, enduro abec5 outlast everything else I've tried in my road bike hubs.

[SmithLakeCeramics]

Thanks again Johnmicheal and thanks Hulk. I will keep all of this in mind if I do decide to tackle the bearings. I am still waiting for my clay to arrive so I can see how the wheel performs in its present condition.

I am sure I will eventually have to replace the bearings, so this is all great information.

[pkeenan]

If anyone is interested, I have uploaded some manuals and various photos of the original splash-pan for the RK2.  I keep thinking someone, somewhere with a 3D printer could possible clone this splash-pan for the folks out there who can no longer find them.  I have babied mine for many years.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uxj2oqg2kotyxm8/AACyzkcXh3BRZBOWnT04KpjWa?dl=0