AveryO Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 To anyone that can help! I’ve been trying to repair and OLD second hand Lockerbie kick wheel that I’ve had for awhile now. Initially I thought it just needed grease because I started to hear a high pitched scratchy/squeaky sound a few months ago, but even after greasing the bearings, the wheel was still making the same sound and slowing down significantly after kicking the wheel. I could feel the difference and it became difficult to throw on the wheel. I’ve used a kick wheel in the past and none have ever slowed down to the extent of the wheel I have at home, so I knew something was off. After consulting with several experts from laguna and axner, it was decided that my wheel needed new bearings. I ordered the bearings to replace the old ones however it took quite a bit of time to be delivered due to factories being closed down, however I finally got the parts in. Of course now with the parts, I needed to take apart the wheel but this is where I got stuck. I’ve realized that the wheel I have does not allow for the wheelhead to detach separately from the shaft and therefore I can’t seem to get to the bearings. I’ve gotten some vague instructions from some people at laguna, but because of the quarantine, they’re unable to get back to me when I asked for further instruction. So far I’ve managed to remove all the bolts holding the upper bearing in place and even removed the hex bolt by the flywheel to remove the shaft, but I can’t seem to get the shaft off of the flywheel to remove the upper bearing and ultimately move the flywheel to get to the bottom bearing either. If anyone out there can help me out that’d be much appreciated! I’d love to get back to throwing ASAP! (: thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 (edited) 38 minutes ago, AveryO said: To anyone that can help! I’ve been trying to repair and OLD second hand Lockerbie kick wheel that I’ve had for awhile now. Initially I thought it just needed grease because I started to hear a high pitched scratchy/squeaky sound a few months ago, but even after greasing the bearings, the wheel was still making the same sound and slowing down significantly after kicking the wheel. I could feel the difference and it became difficult to throw on the wheel. I’ve used a kick wheel in the past and none have ever slowed down to the extent of the wheel I have at home, so I knew something was off. After consulting with several experts from laguna and axner, it was decided that my wheel needed new bearings. I ordered the bearings to replace the old ones however it took quite a bit of time to be delivered due to factories being closed down, however I finally got the parts in. Of course now with the parts, I needed to take apart the wheel but this is where I got stuck. I’ve realized that the wheel I have does not allow for the wheelhead to detach separately from the shaft and therefore I can’t seem to get to the bearings. I’ve gotten some vague instructions from some people at laguna, but because of the quarantine, they’re unable to get back to me when I asked for further instruction. So far I’ve managed to remove all the bolts holding the upper bearing in place and even removed the hex bolt by the flywheel to remove the shaft, but I can’t seem to get the shaft off of the flywheel to remove the upper bearing and ultimately move the flywheel to get to the bottom bearing either. If anyone out there can help me out that’d be much appreciated! I’d love to get back to throwing ASAP! (: thanks in advance! Just a suggestion add some decent pictures of the bearings and wheel head area. As good as you can get like we are seeing through your eyes. Not easy to do I know, but good pictures from far are probably far from good to see if some of this is pressed in place. Edited April 24, 2020 by Bill Kielb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark C. Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 I think these come apart for sure-its been over 40 years since I did that so I'm no help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AveryO Posted April 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2020 Here are some pictures.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AveryO Posted April 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2020 Upper bearing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AveryO Posted April 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2020 Close up of the lower end of the shaft by the flywheel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AveryO Posted April 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2020 Entire shaft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyK Posted April 25, 2020 Report Share Posted April 25, 2020 A few questions, Avery...Are you absolutely sure that the wheel head does not come loose from the shaft? There is probably right hand threads, so if you start a rotation of the head to the right and quickly grab the head and crank it to the left, it may come loose. The connector at the flywheel has a setscrew in that collar. Is the collar fastened to the flywheel and the shaft goes down through the collar and bottoms out in the bottom bearing? If so, treat the setscrew with penetrating oil and remove the setscrew. There are collars at the top and bottom of the upper bearing. Loosen both the collars and see if you can pull upward on the wheelhead and break the shaft loose from the flywheel. If that doesn't work, you're pretty much screwed. What you may do is take a torch to the collar at the flywheel and heat it up a little. then try to break the shaft loose from the flywheel by using the method up above for trying to remove the wheelhead. If you can break the shaft loose from the flywheel, you should be able to pull the head an shaft up through the upper bearing. Then you can replace both bearings and reassemble it all by reversing the removal process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark C. Posted April 26, 2020 Report Share Posted April 26, 2020 Yes (penetrating oil and remove the setscrew.) take the top apart and soak the head (working upside down) sort of speak on the wheel head itself.I would leave the bottom alone.But if you keep working on it use and let sit penetrating oil . I'm pretty sure the head screws off . Have you removed the table top? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted April 26, 2020 Report Share Posted April 26, 2020 (edited) On 4/24/2020 at 10:25 PM, AveryO said: Entire shaft My best idea. The top collar appears to have two set screws and no threads appear to be in the hole of the set screw already removed so I believe you will need to pull the wheel head. I would double check if two set screws up top, remove both and use penetrating oil as has been suggested. It will probably be easier to pull this head by rotating it to break the rust then pulling it once it moves freely. So something to try, remove all set screws from top collar and lubricate, block or trap the wheel head and rotate the shaft with a pipe wrench to break the rusty connection. Just in case it’s threaded you can test rotation in two directions. To block or hold the wheel head you might need to get creative if it does not provide enough leverage to hold by hand. Clamps, band wrench, etc.... you may have to pull the lower bearing if this has one. It most likely pivots on something. Whatever that something is takes the axial load so it could be worn as well. Edited April 26, 2020 by Bill Kielb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted April 26, 2020 Report Share Posted April 26, 2020 If there's a set screw, it should come apart there. These parts have been together for decades, though, so nothing is going to be simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Patten Posted January 22, 2021 Report Share Posted January 22, 2021 I am doing the same thing right now- please let me know if you had any success... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graybeard Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 Avery, is possible to heat the collars with a torch without burning any other parts. you would need to clean the grease around the top bearing and have a fire extinguisher handy. If you can heat the collar it will expand and loosen on the shift. IF OTHER PEOPLE ON THE FORUM THINK THIS IS A BAD IDEA DONT DO IT!! Graybeard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark C. Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 heat is good if it can be done safely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kielb Posted January 23, 2021 Report Share Posted January 23, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, Jason Patten said: I am doing the same thing right now- please let me know if you had any success... Laguna / Axner still sell these and have a generic maintenance document on them you might find helpful. https://www.axner.com/pdf/laguna/Lockerbie_Care_Model_K_and_EK.pdf Having looked at a number of these pictures and the replacement parts I believe the wheel head needs to be fastened to the shaft and the shaft fastened to the kick wheel for this to work without slipping. So first thing I would try is removing all set screws from BOTH collars above and below the top bearing assembly and try removing the wheel head. I believe you might find the wheel is removable and has a smaller permanent shaft of its own that fits inside the main shaft and is retained by the collars. If this guess is all true then loosening this wheel head connection by twisting is likely easiest rather than just pulling up on the wheel head. I would clamp the outer shaft with a pipe wrench or hold onto /step on the kick wheel to prevent it from turning and turn the wheel head back and forth by hand to try and loosen it. If that frees the wheel head then just work it up and out by turning / wiggling while lifting. Last gasp would be to extract the entire shaft from the top bearing by removing the bottom bolt and wiggling to remove the entire shaft from the bottom bearing on up through the top bearing. The new concrete replacement wheels appear to have this bottom collar cast in place through the concrete wheel so the shaft should come out of it, albeit likely with some difficulty. Axner / Laguna seem to have all the parts available https://www.axner.com/lockerbie-kick-wheels.aspx Edited January 23, 2021 by Bill Kielb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason3545 Posted December 9, 2022 Report Share Posted December 9, 2022 It's easier to remove the entire thing as a unit. Replace the set screw, it's the smaller hex head bolt. Tip it so that the motor side is up about two inches higher than the other side. Make sure the upper bearing is detached. It should slide freely up and down the shaft. Wrap a strap just under the head and attach an engine hoist to the strap. Then lift the whole deal up. The bottom bearing has four parts. A cup, the bearing race, the bearing, and a lid. The bearing gets stuck on the shift because of old oil. You will need a two or three jaw puller to remove the bearing and lid. Then clean the parts up as best you can. You will then need to remove the race from the inside of the cup. Use the puller again but reverse the arms so they face out. The race and bearing will then need to be replaced. When putting the wheel back together buy a cheap ratchet strap put it around the flywheel so that it holds the bearing and cup together and on the shift. Prefill the cup with oil. Then put the wheel back together. You may need to cut the strap off when you are done assembling it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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