MatthewV Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 I have collected, used, and modified many recipes. They were sourced from sketchy and reputable places online, a few from books like Mastering Cone 6, and some were taken from recipe book at my university. Many of them have been slightly changed by myself. Today I have absolutely no clue where each one originally came from. So I have to ask: where does the ownership of the information lie? Especially when it comes to something like "Clear" which I first copied from the university bucket and later saw in a book as well. Is it in the public domain already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babs Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 Ethically it is sound, imo, to declare source if asked for a copy , and along with that an explanation of how you've tinkered. Ownership ie MY glaze, unless I am promoting myself as a glazemaker, which I am NOT, would depend I think on how far from the original I had taken it. Writing a book, Still wouldn't rest easily with me unless declaring the original source, if known. Just a few thoughts. Glazes already in the public domain....you use the info, but the thoughts behind the glaze were not "yours" What's with this ownership Mathew/? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatthewV Posted January 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 I like to share freely. It annoys some people and I don't want it to come back to me in a bad way :-) On that note: don't give me recipes that you wish to keep secret! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 Writing a book, Still wouldn't rest easily with me unless declaring the original source, if known. Once you put them out there...... they tend to be looked as being in the "open source" department, to use the computer phrase. TECHNICALLY if you came up with the original, and you wrote it up, the exact recipe is copyrighted (as a piece of writing). But since it is a recipe for some tangible product, I think you'd need something like a patent to protect that. Strange very gray area of law, I would think. (Lawpots?) Many have made money by collecting and sharing other people's glaze recipes without much in the way of attribution. Potters are a bit crazy; we tend to freely share what in most other businesses would be considered "proprietary formulas" that are valued business assets. We also tend to freely go around and show people how to make the objects we make in places like workshops and Youtube videos. We share how to build specialized pieces of equipment. And so on. Try to get APPLE or MICROSOFT to share some of their "secrets" . best, ......................john PS: Luckily..... how they get used, and the kilns they are fired in tend to impact the look of the glazes... so sharing it is only a part of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babs Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 Right, like passing on the secret alchemy recipe?? SO unless you call them Mathews originals and make money out of them, just keep spreading the word! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatthewV Posted January 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 Very good, I will. Telsa Motors is freely allowing use of their patented ideas. It is a social start to patent reform. "If you can forage a fine ceramic piece, you probably don't need to" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 John: I have actually talked to a patent attorney about specific glaze recipes. To have a recipe patented; the ingredients have to be listed in exact amounts to the 0.01 percentile. Then if a person used that very same recipe and changed one ingredient by 0.10%; then it is not infringement. A company in Italy has an US & International patent on one specific crystalline formula with colorants. As most already know, modern formulas are not that modern, just more recent materials filling in old blanks. Taxtile Doat developed the modern crystalline glaze formula back in the late 1880's-early 90's. Even that claim will be disputed, but we are long past the 75-100 year utility patent timeline. Do not want to hurt feelings, but we are not pioneers in the glaze industry- just perfecting a glaze for our specific use. The true pioneers have long ago come and gone. Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Bridge Pottery Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 I have my secret blend of 11 herbs and spices over here at Kiln Fired Ceramics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babs Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 I have my secret blend of 11 herbs and spices over here at Kiln Fired Ceramics Was that the one I copied the recipe off , it was sitting in the background of the last video you shared... Loved Old Lady's photo of markings on the glaze bucket, her recipe!,, a potter I once knew wrote the recipes on her buckets but they were not true to what was in the bucket.... to fool others who wandered into her studio...... I'm not smart enough or of that nature, only hope she kept her marbles to th end , potential for extreme disaster on that pathway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denice Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 I was recently reorganizing and cleaning up my C6 glaze files and found the same glaze with three different names on it and slightly different descriptions. Denice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted January 12, 2016 Report Share Posted January 12, 2016 Thanks Joel- looks like I will be doing carry out tonight from the Colonel. Taxtile Doat Crystalline Recipe from 1880's (sevres museum) Feldspar 33.60 Quartz Sand 47.00 Rutile 9.60 Pure clay kaolin 12.89 Chalk 15.00 Red iron oxide 9.60 Maria Longworth Storer founded the Rookwood Pottery in Cincinnati in 1880: - over 250,000 different glaze mixtures. -developed modern avertine, worked with temmuko, chuns, and flambes. Imagine being around in the 1800's when they fired pottery in bottle kilns (production) using saggars. Guys shoveling coal or stoking wood underneath for up to 30 hours to build and hold temps. No controllers, no kiln setters, no cones, no pyrometers. Marcia: you have a long list of museums showing pieces from the 17-18-19th centuries, perhaps post some. Here is one: http://www.stokemuseums.org.uk/collections/ Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt Posted January 13, 2016 Report Share Posted January 13, 2016 I have reprogrammed my glaze software to reverse engineer any glaze recipe and its optimal firing program based on a photo of that glaze on a pot. So, sorry in advance to anyone who has posted photos of their favourite glazes on these forums or in their gallery. If you are lucky you may get a credit in my book. Yes, Joel, even your photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayaldridge Posted January 13, 2016 Report Share Posted January 13, 2016 Well, no one ever asks me for my glazes, because I fire at Cone 8. All my glazes are modified from Cone 10 or Cone 6 glazes. Somebody must use Cone 8 glazes besides me, because Standard produced a porcelain for that range for at least 30 years. But I never meet anyone like that. I have a whole shtick I can go into about Cone 8 glazes, which involves repeating the phrase "almost as beautiful and simple as Cone 10 glazes" a number of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Campbell Posted January 13, 2016 Report Share Posted January 13, 2016 Glaze recipes .... I give credit to those who develop them and freely share ... I also understand those who test and tweak and end up with something wonderful that they do not share. Kind of presumptuous to think you can just ask this person for it and they have some weird kind of 'obligation' to share. I love to walk into a strange studio and see the names on the glaze buckets ... Hey, that it is a real person's work being passed down ... recently saw a Malcoms Shino and had to smile as I thought about that crazy and very generous man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldlady Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 babs, i have never even tried to develop a recipe of my own. i know the recipe on the bucket is called Chinese Red and was given to our guild members during a workshop by Jane Cullum of Manassas Clay in Virginia. she shared it freely and i am simply passing it on. hope you got the correct numbers because the hairspray ran down without my knowledge until i posted it. i guess i am just a parasite on the real developers of glaze recipes. the most that i do is try different colorants using a base glaze found somewhere public. Bill vanGilder's rutile green, for example, looks wonderful as a clear glaze without the copper. when i add other colors to that base recipe it comes out fantastic in yellow, blue and others. they are all at my other home right now so i cannot tell you more. Bill saw all of them once when i took them to his studio. he really liked the yellow and asked what stain i had used. i think it is wonderful that so many glaze recipes are out there for me to copy. like recipes for cookies, there is a variety for everybody. (sometimes i do not want chocolate chips.) just a note to those of you real chemists who know all the technical reasons for why a certain ingredient does what it does in a certain glaze. those of us who only mix glazes so we can get a particular color and shine and transparency really do not care about the technical reason, just give us a recipe so we can cover our pots in things that are pretty. if it doesn't work on our clay, in our kiln at our favorite temperature, we will just look for another one. we appreciate you and your efforts to try to convert us to chemists but would rather just have the recipe, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatthewV Posted January 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 http://www.glpics.com/matthewv/art/WPA%20Glaze%20Archive%202015.zip This is the collection of glazes I ironed out while in Wellington, New Zealand. Standard Borax Frit can be substituted with Frit 3134. I am now back to Americanizing my glazes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Min Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 just a note to those of you real chemists who know all the technical reasons for why a certain ingredient does what it does in a certain glaze. those of us who only mix glazes so we can get a particular color and shine and transparency really do not care about the technical reason, just give us a recipe so we can cover out pots in things that are pretty. if it doesn't work on our clay, in our kiln at our favorite temperature, we will just look for another one. we appreciate you and your efforts to try to convert us to chemists but would rather just have the recipe, please. we are part of a cult and just want you to try the kool aid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Campbell Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 just a note to those of you real chemists who know all the technical reasons for why a certain ingredient does what it does in a certain glaze. those of us who only mix glazes so we can get a particular color and shine and transparency really do not care about the technical reason, just give us a recipe so we can cover out pots in things that are pretty. if it doesn't work on our clay, in our kiln at our favorite temperature, we will just look for another one. we appreciate you and your efforts to try to convert us to chemists but would rather just have the recipe, please. we are part of a cult and just want you to try the kool aid I am terrible at chemistry but I can relate it to cooking ... I can replicate a great yellow cake recipe but a chef would be bold enough to add sour cream, more eggs, some chocolate ... and make it a totally magical experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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