Sullie Posted February 6 Report Share Posted February 6 I built a wooden karatsu kickwheel over Christmas break and have been working on it since then. I remembered hearing or reading that potters in Japan used much softer clay to work on these types of wheels so I've been doing that with some success. I'm used to throwing off the hump and have been using that method almost exclusively for a few years, but only as a hobby potter. I'm now putting in the time and practice to work up to becoming a production potter. My issue is that with both a slower wheel and softer clay, I find that the techniques I'm used to using aren't working so well. It feels like I'm learning to throw all over again! Do you know if there are books about Japanese or Korean throwing methods, that could give me some indication as to how I should be doing things differently or what I can expect with this new setup? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callie Beller Diesel Posted February 6 Report Share Posted February 6 Mostly throwing large amounts of items on a slow wheel with soft clay is an exercise in economy of motion. In the absence of knowing exactly what you’re doing/not doing, it’s hard to troubleshoot exactly. A good resource to check out might be YouTube though, because sometimes a video can reveal a lot in a short amount of time. If you find it difficult to watch a video tutorial, something that can help is adjusting the playback speed. But if you need text versions, I’ll tag @PeterH, as he’s got a gift for tracking down all kinds of good articles. I’m curious as to why you’d want to use a kick wheel if you’re going in to production pottery though. Kick wheels tend to be harder on the body than electric ones, and that’s an important consideration when you’re looking at a job that can have a high propensity for repetitive motion injuries. Production pottery of any kind is about economy of motion and making things efficiently, so that you can make a lot. Any choice made about how you work that isn’t about efficiency has to have a compelling reason to be included in your process. If you’re using a particular technique that takes more time, you have to find ways of offsetting that elsewhere in the process. Or the results have to be able to provide enough value in the finished work to be worth the effort. Rae Reich, Hulk, Kelly in AK and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted February 8 Report Share Posted February 8 (edited) On 2/6/2024 at 4:03 PM, Callie Beller Diesel said: I’ll tag @PeterH Firstly I think Callie is right that you may have more success looking for videos. The short video format might favour highlighting little tips and tricks. I suspect that "the East" may tend towards a culture of immersion in the process rather than highlighting details of the process. Sorry, couldn't find any books, but a few minor hits and follow-on questions on the pros and cons of: - types of wheel: electric, kick & banding - throwing vs trimming - asking Denice https://www.benthampottery.com/throwing-pots-left-handed/ Throwing Pots Left Handed ... Throwing is a two handed process. In Japan they spin the wheel the other way and that is nothing to do with right or left handedness. Just carry on as normal. The psychology is interesting. Potentially the focus may be on the inside instead of the outside of the pot which affects the results in an interesting way ... I’ve been throwing for 43 years, teaching for 20: left handed potters throwing counter clockwise have the advantage, as the left hand is inside, and easier to control the form that way. ... I am left handed and learned right handed. All you are doing is having the strong hand inside the form like they do in Japan. Handedness isn’t important on an electric non-kick wheel. ... I find that the issue isn’t often with throwing but with trimming. Most people can learn to throw either way, but trimming is a whole other story. I teach with my wheel turning clockwise and just explain and demonstrate the different hand positions ... Given that for most of us our strongest hand is also the one with the finest control I'm not even sure that having the same spin for both throwing and trimming is necessarily optimum. (Although constantly switching may outweigh any advantages.) A couple of videos from Trimming Mugs/bowls Without The Wheel https://community.ceramicartsdaily.org/topic/13230-trimming-mugsbowls-without-the-wheel/?do=findComment&comment=97096 Pedantically a misnomer, as both videos show trimming on a wheel-head, but using it like a banding-wheel. https://youtu.be/f64J6C48ZSo https://youtu.be/3mmJwnhPivI Couldn't find anything significant on electrified kick wheels, but did find this. Hopefully technology is advancing towards a combined electric/kick wheel where you only need to kick where there are positive artistic advantages in doing so. As long-term kick-wheel use could be hard on the body: although maybe artistically good for the soul. So my only conclusion is you consider which wheel/spin combination works "best" for each of your activities: such as - opening-out - main forming - finishing-off - trimming. Is there a clear winner, or is some sort of mixed strategy better? @Denice any comments? You obviously have some regrets. Edited February 8 by PeterH Callie Beller Diesel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pres Posted February 8 Report Share Posted February 8 Google searches on Japanese pottery throwing methods do bring up quite a bit of information. You may find some Utube videos that will help you also. Years ago, I was having problems with S cracks in the bottom of small vessels off of the hump. . a utube video showed me to make a pancake on the hump and then bring up the sides and then pull the walls. This was a Japanese method. best, Pres Magnolia Mud Research 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted February 8 Report Share Posted February 8 17 minutes ago, Pres said: Google searches on Japanese pottery throwing methods do bring up quite a bit of information. You may find some Utube videos that will help you also. Years ago, I was having problems with S cracks in the bottom of small vessels off of the hump. . a utube video showed me to make a pancake on the hump and then bring up the sides and then pull the walls. This was a Japanese method.best, Pres A good example of the type of video you might hope to find, which also illustrates a potential problem. Pres explains the technique works because it helps align the clay particles in a good way, but this is not obvious from seeing the video. You really want to know both how and why, although seeing how can help you discover why. Pres 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly in AK Posted February 9 Report Share Posted February 9 I have to jump on the train and say that not only will it be easier to find video references for what you want to learn, but they’ll probably give you more information faster. You can use your experience to interpret what you see: How soft does the clay look? How are different sizes of pots approached? What is the relationship between work done on the clay and work to keep the wheel moving, and does it change as the piece progresses? I like to read more than I like watching videos, but some things are easier to apprehend seen than read about. Pres 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denice Posted February 9 Report Share Posted February 9 The only reason I sold my kickwheel is because I was 68 at the time and was having trouble kicking up the wheel fast enough. I also had my knee separate on vacation, a doctor took a x-ray of it and wrap it up. He told me that I had extremely strong bones in that leg and asked how I did it. I told him it was my kicking leg I used on my wheel for throwing. I used that wheel for forty years and it has gone to a new home. I think a potter should use the wheel of their choice, to me a wheel is personable. Denice Hulk, Pres and PeterH 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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