Advice on repairing a kiln

[Shelly]

I’ve never used a kiln before and i would like some advice on repairing a Skutt kiln I got. It hasn’t been used in years and I haven’t had the chance yet to turn it on. Parts of the elements are broken off and I’ll have to replace them most likely. The brick sides near the bottom seem in bad shape. I would love advice on what to do first and how to go about fixing the kiln to good condition. Would I need to replace the bricks near the bottom or could I fill it in with with something? And how should I go about taking the rust off the outside of the kiln? I appreciate any replies I get! 

[Mark C.]

Looks like a 3 phase kiln you have there -which will need new elements anyway-Neil can guide you thru that 3 phase to single phase conversion-not sure about the control box needed?? in this conversion.

I can tell you that the outer jackets need replacing as well as any bricks that are all busted up and you need new elements (make sure you have the 3 phase at location) or get the regular 220 singel phase elements-

You can look up the prices at skutt.com to see what this will all cost-my guess is about $700-1,000$ depends on the bricks and how many jackets and what the control box may need??

I rebuilt a larger kiln this January -I only neded two bricks and all the jackets and all the elements simalair to yours.

I am a mechanical person and have done kiln work before as well.

 

 

[neilestrick]

You'll need to replace any bricks that have element grooves that are broken more than an inch. Definitely the bottom row where the whole groove is gone. Bricks run about $14.50  each depending on which ones you need. There are straight brick (2 straight grooves), peep brick (have the peep hole), terminal brick (have the angled groove), and the sitter brick (kiln sitter tube goes through it). Pull the elements, replace the brick, put in the new elements. Also take a look at the wiring. If any of it is turning brown or getting crispy when you bend it, replace it. There's the wiring harness, which is all the wires from the sitter to the switches, and the feeder wires, which are the wires from the switches to the elements.

Don't worry about removing the rust. You could go over it with some fine steel wool, but it's not an issue unless it's rusting through, in which case you'll need to replace the band.

The serial plate says 1 phase, I think Mark misread it. It says it was originally set up for 208 volt service. If you're using it in your home, you'll have 240 volt service, so you'll have to be sure to get 240 volt elements. It says it'll pul 26.7 amps, so it should be on a 40 amp circuit.

The blank ring (the middle ring without elements) will lower the peak firing temp of the kiln to cone 1, so if you plan to fire anything above low fire temps you'll have to remove it.

[Mark C.]

( It says it was originally set up for 208 volt service)

thats the part I saw but knew you could talk her thru it.

[Shelly]

Thanks Neil and Mark! You explained it very well and I have a better understanding on what to do. So I’m a bit confused on when Neil said I should remove the middle piece in order to do a firing above cone 1. Do I just remove the piece and and put the rest of the kiln together? Also, should I call the Skutt company on what bricks would fit this kiln or are most bricks they sell online generally the same size? 

[neilestrick]

The middle ring doesn't have elements, so it lowers the kiln's ability to reach higher temps. Basically it increases the size of the kiln by 20%, but doesn't add any heat. Chances are the red control boxes have plugs that connect them, so to remove it all you have to do is lift off the top section, lift off the middle section, then replace the top section. You'll see the plugs when you lift off the sections. Inspect them while it's apart and check for corrosion. If someone upgraded the red control boxes at some point, then the boxes will have a hinge on one side, and the plugs will have been replaced with a hard wired system. If that's the case, open the boxes, unhook the wires, remove the middle section, and wire it back up the same way.

[Shelly]

thank you for explaining Neil! I really appreciate it. I’ll make sure to look into the control boxes and see what I can do. 

[oldlady]

shelly and neil,  i have dismantled an old paragon kiln and have a stack of bricks.   they do have 2 element  grooves in them.   i do not know where you are, shelly, or whether the bricks are exactly the same as the skutt bricks would be.   however, free bricks with just your shipping cost might save a lot of money.   using one row of my bricks might work if you need to replace an element anyway.

my wedge shaped  bricks measure 7 1/2 short side of wedge, 2 1/2 thick 8 3/4 long side of wedge and 4 1/2 high.   there are 20 perfect bricks and one that has a peep hole cut in aprox the middle of the bottom.

your kiln might not be as big but??????maybe??

[Shelly]

Hmm, well I just measured my bricks and they seem to have the exact measurements as yours. The longer side of the wedge is about 8 3/4 to 9 inches, which is the measurement I wasn’t too sure on. 
Have you ever seen anyone replace a kiln with bricks that come from a different company??  
Would the kiln work with different bricks?? 
It would help me a lot if I could use them. 
 

[oldlady]

shelly, a brick is a brick.  your house, my house, same size brick.   they are made by brick companies, not kiln companies.  the elements simply sit in the brick grooves.  the elements are the operating part of the kiln.  as long as they can lie comfortably in the grooves, i am sure they do not care whose bricks they once were.

there are several questions you need to answer.  

WHERE are you? 

do you have 2 grooves in each brick, it looks like it from the photo but measure yours, i did that so we can compare numbers.  are yours the same height and thickness?  are any of the broken ones the kind with the slant?

a little input from our kiln expert, neil, would settle your thoughts on this.

[neilestrick]

1 hour ago, oldlady said:

shelly, a brick is a brick.  your house, my house, same size brick.   they are made by brick companies, not kiln companies.  the elements simply sit in the brick grooves.  the elements are the operating part of the kiln.  as long as they can lie comfortably in the grooves, i am sure they do not care whose bricks they once were.

there are several questions you need to answer.  

WHERE are you? 

do you have 2 grooves in each brick, it looks like it from the photo but measure yours, i did that so we can compare numbers.  are yours the same height and thickness?  are any of the broken ones the kind with the slant?

a little input from our kiln expert, neil, would settle your thoughts on this.

First, the bricks need to be cut at the correct angle. There's not much difference in the length, because every size is made to minimize brick waste. So kilns of different diameters will have different angles at the corners, but it's subtle. Generally, we see kilns with 8, 10, or 12 sides. Little test kilns might have 5 or 6 sides, and there are even some out there with 7 sides. You really need to figure out if the replacement bricks are for the same size kiln. Measuring the angle of the corner is the best way to tell if you don't know. There's only a few degrees difference in angle between a 10 sided kiln to a 12 sided kiln, which makes for a very small difference in length (which can easily be measured wrong), but is very obvious if you try to use the wrong one.

Second, the grooves may or may not line up from brand to brand. The grooves might be slightly higher or lower on the face of the brick, and will probably be different depths. For example, Paragon and Skutt have totally different grooves. Skutt grooves are shallow, Paragon are deep. The problem with that is that the elements won't transition nicely from one brick to the next, and are more prone to popping out of the groove or bunching up at the corners.

Bricks are cheap in the big picture, and it's easier to deal with bricks that are from the same manufacturer of your kiln.

[Mark C.]

Buy your bricks from Skutt-who is the same company that made that kiln.

Get your elements and everything else needed from skutt at same time-you make a list  of whats needed and call them -the stuff is also listed for your model online at Skutt.com. Since you are new to all this call and talk to the them ordering it.

You may also have a limit on what you want to spend-read my post above about costs when I did mine this last January as well.