Cylena Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 I am trying to make porcelain sticks/branches by painting twigs with paperclay slip (Scarva's Flax paperclay watered down). I know I need to have at least three layers but often some of the first coat rubs off as I'm applying the second. I've tried applying first coat by dipping then further layers with a brush, letting it dry completely between coats. I've considered spraying but I'd have to source my own sprayer with a wide nozzle. I'd look into it if there was a chance it would work. Or perhaps I should buy Scarva's ready made paperclay slip? Any advice appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted March 26 Report Share Posted March 26 Loosely related Min 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 Try a google for paperclay nest, then click on the images option. It may at least give an idea of the state-of-the-art. Hits include https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fdeniserouleau.com%2Fworkshops%2Fadventuresinpaperclay&psig=AOvVaw24dMc2zyf9RW6-ztQqTML1&ust=1711619956846000&source=images&cd=vfe&opi=89978449&ved=2ahUKEwj2n7Wtl5SFAxUqVKQEHdaCBYoQr4kDegQIARBi https://judithrosenthal.com/section/125628-Sticks and Stones.html https://judithrosenthal.com/section/125628-Sticks and Stones.html Hyn Patty and Rae Reich 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted March 27 Author Report Share Posted March 27 These images look great! And prove that it can be done. I've just put about 15 individual sticks in the kiln. Will post images when they come out. Rae Reich 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted March 27 Report Share Posted March 27 On 3/26/2024 at 5:19 PM, Cylena said: I am trying to make porcelain sticks/branches by painting twigs with paperclay slip (Scarva's Flax paperclay watered down). I know I need to have at least three layers but often some of the first coat rubs off as I'm applying the second. I've tried applying first coat by dipping then further layers with a brush, letting it dry completely between coats. I've considered spraying but I'd have to source my own sprayer with a wide nozzle. I'd look into it if there was a chance it would work. Or perhaps I should buy Scarva's ready made paperclay slip? Any advice appreciated! Do you apply the paperclay before or after you've assembled the nest? I seem to remember people coating wire mesh with paperclay by repeatedly dipping & drying. http://antjhfoo.blogspot.com/2010/10/paper-clay-and-wire-mesh.html ... and organics such as cloth https://ceramicartsnetwork.org/pottery-making-illustrated/pottery-making-illustrated-article/Impressions-Imprints-and-Dipping# Googling making nests (again with the images option) shows the appearance of nests made from various substances -- including twigs, straw and coir. I wonder if something less substantial than twigs would burn-out better after coating with paperclay. PS Birds get revenge by using anti-bird spikes in nests https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-66163943 Biologist Auke-Florian Hiemstra says the birds seem to be using the spikes as humans intended them - to keep pests away Rae Reich 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted March 28 Author Report Share Posted March 28 Thank you for the links. I'm not trying to make nests though. I need individual branches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly in AK Posted April 6 Report Share Posted April 6 The photographs suggest multiple techniques. Slip casting or a two part sprig mold to capture the finer details seems more appropriate for some parts. Paper clay is a good choice to get something long and skinny to survive the process. I imagine it’s possible to slip cast paper clay Coating with slip progressively diminishes surface detail, and you've got to build up a little just for structural integrity. It’s also going to shrink around the branch. Paper clay is miraculous, not sure it’s this miraculous. Good luck on your challenging project! Rae Reich and PeterH 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 7 Author Report Share Posted April 7 On 4/6/2024 at 9:31 AM, Kelly in AK said: The photographs suggest multiple techniques. Slip casting or a two part sprig mold to capture the finer details seems more appropriate for some parts. Paper clay is a good choice to get something long and skinny to survive the process. I imagine it’s possible to slip cast paper clay Coating with slip progressively diminishes surface detail, and you've got to build up a little just for structural integrity. It’s also going to shrink around the branch. Paper clay is miraculous, not sure it’s this miraculous. Good luck on your challenging project! This is exactly the challenge: enough coats to survive the kiln YET STILL have the details that makes it unique. The pictures attached are from my first attempts where I painted on paperclay slip with a brush. (Banana for scale lol) Most of the branches were 50-60cm long so all of them are only partially intact. I'm getting better coverage by dipping rather painting the slip but I don't want to lose the thorny-ness of the thorns. Maybe a plaster mold would work? Hmmm... PeterH and Rae Reich 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 7 Author Report Share Posted April 7 Couple of close ups Rae Reich, Hulk and Kelly in AK 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Reich Posted April 7 Report Share Posted April 7 I wonder if some of your breakage during firing is due to the irregular shapes of the branches, so that they do not rest their weight equally on the points of contact with the shelf. Maybe a shallow, silica sand filled tray to nestle them in so that they’re resting on the sand all along their lengths? Hulk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted April 7 Report Share Posted April 7 Well done! Is that before or after firing? If it's after I'm very pleasantly surprised at the absence of visible cracking. 5 hours ago, Cylena said: Maybe a plaster mold would work? Hmmm.. Looking at the angles those thorns come out at aren't you going to need a highly multi-part mould to avoid undercuts? (And/or a spectacularly meandering parting line.) Making the problem of achieving a clay build-up for your first plaster pouring even more difficult/fiddly. PS Idle thought. If the wood has burned out cleanly would casting a layer of paperclay inside the bisque be possible? It would strengthen the work -- and allow the original layer to be a thin as the first firing stresses allow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 23 hours ago, Rae Reich said: I wonder if some of your breakage during firing is due to the irregular shapes of the branches, so that they do not rest their weight equally on the points of contact with the shelf. Maybe a shallow, silica sand filled tray to nestle them in so that they’re resting on the sand all along their lengths? Interesting point! I’ll ask the kiln tech if there’s a tray available. Rae Reich 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 8 Author Report Share Posted April 8 23 hours ago, PeterH said: Well done! Is that before or after firing? If it's after I'm very pleasantly surprised at the absence of visible cracking. Looking at the angles those thorns come out at aren't you going to need a highly multi-part mould to avoid undercuts? (And/or a spectacularly meandering parting line.) Making the problem of achieving a clay build-up for your first plaster pouring even more difficult/fiddly. PS Idle thought. If the wood has burned out cleanly would casting a layer of paperclay inside the bisque be possible? It would strengthen the work -- and allow the original layer to be a thin as the first firing stresses allow. Yes I think you’re right, a plaster mold would be complicated and unlikely to work. Pictures are after 1 firing. The wood has completely burned out but I don’t think casting inside the bisque will work for my aims. I want to keep the translucency. Rae Reich and PeterH 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Reich Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 12 hours ago, Cylena said: Interesting point! I’ll ask the kiln tech if there’s a tray available. You can make a custom one and bisque it while making more branch tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Reich Posted April 9 Report Share Posted April 9 A description of using silica sand in a saggar for support of fragile work during firing ^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 9 Author Report Share Posted April 9 5 hours ago, Rae Reich said: You can make a custom one and bisque it while making more branch tests. Great idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cylena Posted April 9 Author Report Share Posted April 9 4 hours ago, Rae Reich said: A description of using silica sand in a saggar for support of fragile work during firing ^ Beautiful sculpture! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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