Jump to content


Photo

Ky ball clay compaired to Tenn. ball clay ?


  • Please log in to reply
14 replies to this topic

#1 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 26 October 2011 - 10:50 PM

How is everyone doing? I do not have access to a glazing program to be able to compair composition of the two ball clays. I have a ash glaze calling for Tenn Ball clay. All I have is Ky ball clay. I did a one for one exchange. Will it make a big difference? Maybe someone out there has checked into this before and would be willing to share this information. The glaze is at the test tile phase so if it does not work I am not out a whole lot. I would like to compair the two when I get some Tenn Ball clay. Don't forget to smile. thank you, Kabe

#2 Benhim

Benhim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 193 posts
  • LocationBattle Ground Washington

Posted 27 October 2011 - 12:37 AM

Listed in the free section of Digital Fire are 7 Kentucky Ball Clays and 5 Tennessee Ball Clays. Which two are you talking about?

The short answer is yes there is a huge difference these clays. Taking the oxide compounds out of the equation and focusing just on the silica to alumina ratio alone, this varies to a point that would change a glaze significantly.


BenCo Ceramics


#3 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 27 October 2011 - 08:51 PM

Listed in the free section of Digital Fire are 7 Kentucky Ball Clays and 5 Tennessee Ball Clays. Which two are you talking about?

The short answer is yes there is a huge difference these clays. Taking the oxide compounds out of the equation and focusing just on the silica to alumina ratio alone, this varies to a point that would change a glaze significantly.




#4 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 27 October 2011 - 08:53 PM


Listed in the free section of Digital Fire are 7 Kentucky Ball Clays and 5 Tennessee Ball Clays. Which two are you talking about?

The short answer is yes there is a huge difference these clays. Taking the oxide compounds out of the equation and focusing just on the silica to alumina ratio alone, this varies to a point that would change a glaze significantly.




#5 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 27 October 2011 - 08:54 PM



Listed in the free section of Digital Fire are 7 Kentucky Ball Clays and 5 Tennessee Ball Clays. Which two are you talking about?

The short answer is yes there is a huge difference these clays. Taking the oxide compounds out of the equation and focusing just on the silica to alumina ratio alone, this varies to a point that would change a glaze significantly.




#6 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 27 October 2011 - 09:02 PM

Thank you for your responce. The Ky ball clay is OM4. The recipe did not specify which Tenn ball clay. So I guess I'll have to see how the test tile comes out and go from there. I put a tile under it just in case. I am seeking information on which glaze program is the best product to buy. Are you satisfied with Digital Fir? Have you used other ones besides Digital Fire? All I have ever used was Glaze Master. Thank you for thew help.

#7 Benhim

Benhim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 193 posts
  • LocationBattle Ground Washington

Posted 28 October 2011 - 04:11 AM

Thank you for your responce. The Ky ball clay is OM4. The recipe did not specify which Tenn ball clay. So I guess I'll have to see how the test tile comes out and go from there. I put a tile under it just in case. I am seeking information on which glaze program is the best product to buy. Are you satisfied with Digital Fir? Have you used other ones besides Digital Fire? All I have ever used was Glaze Master. Thank you for thew help.


I do like digital fire. It's helped me understand glaze calc immensely. The longer I spend studying glaze formulation on this program the more I learn. I've read most of the articles on the free section of the program. They are worth the time to read. Purchasing the program is not by any means a waste of money, if you're serious about making your own glazes.

I do a lot of reading though, just in the last three weeks I've read 50 or so blogs, 5 books, numerous articles and forum threads. If potters today have a problem it's that there's too much information out there. Some of it's very good, and some of it's very bad, with an immeasurable amount of in between. Digital fire has a wealth of good information.

I had a recent change in my process and have had to play catch up. Going from cone 10 heavy reduction to having a small electric kiln forces a person to either struggle to produce mediocre pots, or do the work to figure out how to work with in the confines of the equipment. I have a strong base of knowledge from college on which to draw, however almost none of it pertains to the temperatures and atmospheres I'm working in now. I spent almost two years focusing primarily on wood, salt/soda and reduction firing, so needless to say this is an adjustment. If the upcoming portion of my career is successful it's due at least in some part because of the digital fire program.

As for your OM4 sub for Tenn ball clay. OM4 is an industry standard upon which a majority of formulation relies upon. If you don't get what you're supposed to you're likely to get something that works. That is if your base glaze was sound and you're only question was OM4. It's likely that they meant OM4 anyway, for some reason I see people call it Tennessee Ball clay even though it's mined in Kentucky. Let us know how it comes out.

BenCo Ceramics


#8 JBaymore

JBaymore

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 2,939 posts
  • LocationWilton, NH USA

Posted 28 October 2011 - 05:28 AM

Some of it's very good, and some of it's very bad, with an immeasurable amount of in between.


You said a real mouthfull there! Oh so true.


I am seeking information on which glaze program is the best product to buy. Are you satisfied with Digital Fir? Have you used other ones besides Digital Fire? All I have ever used was Glaze Master.



On the subject of DigitalFire's Insight as a glaze calc program....... it is my personal favorite. It is the "required text" for my BFA ceramic materials course that itself is a required course for all ceramics majors at the college. I think that the Level II version of the software is a GREAT deal.... well worth the price. Level II gets you (time limited, with cheap renewals) access to online aspects that are an AMAZING resource. If you think the free stuff on their website is good.. .... wait till you get the stuff within the paid version.

And if you want to see if you like the basic Level I Insight program.... download the fully functional demo version and try it out. You can get it right on the main website. Tony Hansen (the programmer) is a great guy.... very knowledgable, and offers excellent and almost INSTANT support. If you have questions about Insight .... he'll answer them.

http://digitalfire.c...p?action=rescan

I was one of the first people to write commercial glaze calculation software for home computer use (see CM articles and ads back from the early 80's as well as the NCECA Journal from the 84' Boston NCECA conference). Written in the very limited BASIC language...... and working on tiny amounts or RAM by today's standards. Sold some for a short while, but decided I was a potter and kiln builder, not a programmer ......... and left the field to those who were real programmers. If I had continued on with that idea... Insight would be the type of program I'd have wanted to write.


Kabe... post the recipe for that ash glaze and we can tell you more. But of course it might be out of the kiln by now....... so........ Posted Image .


best,

..............john
John Baymore
Immediate Past President; Potters Council
Professor of Ceramics; New Hampshire Insitute of Art

http://www.JohnBaymore.com

#9 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 29 October 2011 - 07:27 PM

Some of it's very good, and some of it's very bad, with an immeasurable amount of in between.


You said a real mouthfull there! Oh so true.


I am seeking information on which glaze program is the best product to buy. Are you satisfied with Digital Fir? Have you used other ones besides Digital Fire? All I have ever used was Glaze Master.



On the subject of DigitalFire's Insight as a glaze calc program....... it is my personal favorite. It is the "required text" for my BFA ceramic materials course that itself is a required course for all ceramics majors at the college. I think that the Level II version of the software is a GREAT deal.... well worth the price. Level II gets you (time limited, with cheap renewals) access to online aspects that are an AMAZING resource. If you think the free stuff on their website is good.. .... wait till you get the stuff within the paid version.

And if you want to see if you like the basic Level I Insight program.... download the fully functional demo version and try it out. You can get it right on the main website. Tony Hansen (the programmer) is a great guy.... very knowledgable, and offers excellent and almost INSTANT support. If you have questions about Insight .... he'll answer them.

http://digitalfire.c...p?action=rescan

I was one of the first people to write commercial glaze calculation software for home computer use (see CM articles and ads back from the early 80's as well as the NCECA Journal from the 84' Boston NCECA conference). Written in the very limited BASIC language...... and working on tiny amounts or RAM by today's standards. Sold some for a short while, but decided I was a potter and kiln builder, not a programmer ......... and left the field to those who were real programmers. If I had continued on with that idea... Insight would be the type of program I'd have wanted to write.


Kabe... post the recipe for that ash glaze and we can tell you more. But of course it might be out of the kiln by now....... so........ Posted Image .


best,

..............john



wood ash 500
Custer Feldspar 625
Albany Clay 625
Flint 125
Tenn Ball 125
Cobalt Oxide 20
I have never fired this glaze, I an looking for a glaze that looks like clouds, if this glaze looks like what I hope it does it could be a good start. thank you for the information on glaze programs I will download the free copy and give it a try. I will post a picture of the test tile as soon as it is fired. I work at a small collage and they graciously opened the ceramics dept for me to play in. I am sort of at the mercy of the students on how fast they can load up the kiln so they can fire it. I just glad to have acess to a high fire reduction Kiln. Im digging out all my old glazes from collage. What fun!

#10 Benhim

Benhim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 193 posts
  • LocationBattle Ground Washington

Posted 30 October 2011 - 03:56 PM

OM4 is going to be what you want in that glaze at around 6% it's probably primarily being used for a boost in alumina and as a suspension agent. It would help to tighten it up just slightly keeping it from going all over the place. Are you using Barnard or Alberta in place of Albany?

BenCo Ceramics


#11 Kabe

Kabe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 132 posts
  • LocationMo.

Posted 30 October 2011 - 09:44 PM

OM4 is going to be what you want in that glaze at around 6% it's probably primarily being used for a boost in alumina and as a suspension agent. It would help to tighten it up just slightly keeping it from going all over the place. Are you using Barnard or Alberta in place of Albany?



I am using c-020-001 Albany slip substitute (Bailey Ceramic supply) I bought it for some other glaze about a year or two ago. . I am not for sure without looking through my old records.
I took about a year or so off. Kind of swore off of clay but I relasped and am back at it. I believe I came make a living at it if I keep trying. It is like the story of the hunter that thought he shoot a turkey but when he went over to see why it hadn't fallen or flew. He found that he had just shot a tree stump that looked like a turkey. He returned to where he had taken the shoot and as he tells it, "that stump looked so much like a turkey I had to shoot it again". I kind of feel like I am back to shooting turkeys because I still believe I can make a go of it. It has been a while since I have brewed up any glazes so I am not sure why I bought the Albany Slip Sub but I think I bought it in place of albany clay. I could be wrong, it has happened before. I don't think I have Alzheimers but I seem to have sometimers. Thank you for the help And don't forget to smile

#12 Benhim

Benhim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 193 posts
  • LocationBattle Ground Washington

Posted 31 October 2011 - 02:44 AM

Well I've not used that one, only Alberta and Barnard, so I can't speak to that substitute. Good luck with your glaze, sounds like it will be a nice runny blue!

BenCo Ceramics


#13 GEP

GEP

    Moderator / full time potter ^6 stoneware

  • Moderators
  • 821 posts
  • LocationSilver Spring, MD

Posted 04 October 2013 - 09:19 PM

Hi glaze gurus,

I found this old thread, and I have the exact same question regarding a different glaze recipe. I need to make a bucket of Shino for a wood-firing next weekend, but no time to shop for ingredients. I am out of Tennessee Ball Clay. I'm not positive which one I was using before (bought it so long ago I forgot where I bought it) but I believe it is Tennessee #1. Can I substitute OM4 in this recipe?

8.1 Soda Ash
39.3 Neph Sy
30.6 Spodumene
4.8 EPK
17.2 Tennessee Ball Clay
Mea Rhee
Good Elephant Pottery
http://www.goodelephant.com

#14 bciskepottery

bciskepottery

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,444 posts
  • LocationNorthern Virginia

Posted 04 October 2013 - 09:55 PM

Here is a comparison of both using Glazemaster.  Slight change in ratio of Al to Si.

 

Recipe Name:  GEP Shino 1

 

Cone:  10     Color: 

Firing:  Reduction     Surface: 

 

Amount     Ingredient

8.1          Soda Ash

39.3          Nepheline Syenite

30.6          Spodumene--Foote

4.8          Kaolin--EPK

17.2          Ball Clay--Tennessee #10

 

100         Total

 

 

Unity          Oxide

.251           Li2O

.608           Na2O

.103           K2O

.01           MgO

.027           CaO

1.000          Total

 

.994           Al2O3

.025           Fe2O3

 

3.85           SiO2

.014           TiO2

0           P2O5

 

3.9          Ratio

84.8            Exp

 

Comments: 

-----------------------------------

Calculations by GlazeMasterâ„¢

www.masteringglazes.com

------------------------------------

 

 

Recipe Name:  GEP Shino 2

 

Cone:  10     Color: 

Firing:       Surface: 

 

Amount     Ingredient

8.1          Soda Ash

39.3          Nepheline Syenite

30.6          Spodumene--Foote

4.8          Kaolin--EPK

17.2          Ball Clay--Old Mine #4

 

100         Total

 

 

Unity          Oxide

.251           Li2O

.605           Na2O

.106           K2O

.012           MgO

.025           CaO

1.000          Total

 

.973           Al2O3

.025           Fe2O3

 

3.879           SiO2

.012           TiO2

0           P2O5

 

4          Ratio

84.7            Exp

 

Comments: 

-----------------------------------

Calculations by GlazeMasterâ„¢

www.masteringglazes.com

------------------------------------



#15 GEP

GEP

    Moderator / full time potter ^6 stoneware

  • Moderators
  • 821 posts
  • LocationSilver Spring, MD

Posted 04 October 2013 - 10:17 PM

Ok looks like the substitution should be ok. Thank you!!
Mea Rhee
Good Elephant Pottery
http://www.goodelephant.com




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users