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What Kind Of Kiln Shelves To Use?

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#41 perkolator

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Posted 03 February 2014 - 03:11 PM

Has anyone got the Bailey electric kiln? I'm looking at the 2327-10, just out of curiosity. 

http://www.baileypot...elec2327-10.htm

 

I'm wondering what people's experiences are with this kiln. Are the elements easy to change? Pros and cons are appreciated.

 

Thanks!

pretty sure the top loading Bailey electrics are the same as a Skutt, where elements go directly into the soft brick channel.  It's the front-loaders he now makes that have the element holders similar to an L&L.

 

Personally, I don't see the issue with a Skutt kilns, I think they are great.  I'm on the West Coast, they are also, so why would I not support them?  I don't really ever have issues where I need help with them, but when I do call Skutt I always have quick help and excellent service.  Have 7 here in studio and know numerous people that own them at home or in other schools.  Seems everyone here always complains about the element setup in them, but seriously how often are you swapping elements?  Once a year, once every other year?  I swap elements all the time with the amount of abuse undergrads throw at my kilns and they are all nearing 20 years old, also with most of their original bricks until recently when I did a full rebuild on a few of them.  Sure it might be easier to pull out a rigid element holder to keep from messing up soft brick, but that hard element holder is going to soak up more energy than the soft brick would - making a less efficient use of the energy going into your work.  

 

As for those Advancers....drool....I would personally just stick with regular alumina shelves until you are ready for another big investment, since you're looking at investing in a kiln now.

 

someday I will get some, but man are they expensive.  Actually, I tried getting my studio some Advancers a year ago, but after talking with Marshall at SSFBS, he said they wouldn't work because of the way that we use full hard-brick to stack our kilns -- something about the thermal shock of the heat difference between where the shelf gets sandwiched between brick vs the areas not sandwiched.  Marshall sent me lots of info regarding these shelves and I can definitely see where they would excel and could potentially save lots of money in the long run if taken care of.  Unfortunately, it's hard to convince administrators that spending 3x the cost of something that's already expensive, will be worth it long-term (since our regular SiC shelves already end up around $125/ea for a 12" x 28" x 3/4")



#42 bciskepottery

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Posted 03 February 2014 - 03:49 PM

Has anyone got the Bailey electric kiln? I'm looking at the 2327-10, just out of curiosity. 
http://www.baileypot...elec2327-10.htm
 
I'm wondering what people's experiences are with this kiln. Are the elements easy to change? Pros and cons are appreciated.
 
Thanks!


I recall reading somewhere that Bailey electric kilns are made by Tucker Cone Art kilns. Could be wrong, but they sure look similar.

#43 neilestrick

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Posted 03 February 2014 - 11:36 PM

Just got 6 more 14x28 Corelite shelves for $48 each. Nice and light, although slightly thicker than my other shelves. I've been using a set of them for a year now with no warpage at all.


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#44 Karen B

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Posted 04 February 2014 - 08:00 AM

Wondering if the corelite or advancer shelves heat and cool at a rate that is closer to the heating and cooling of the clay?

I have issues with this on standard shelves when firing large flat platters or tiles.Solutions have been previously discussed for raising platters off shelves, but not whether changing shelves will help.



#45 ShellHawk

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Posted 04 February 2014 - 08:57 PM

 

Has anyone got the Bailey electric kiln? I'm looking at the 2327-10, just out of curiosity. 

http://www.baileypot...elec2327-10.htm

 

I'm wondering what people's experiences are with this kiln. Are the elements easy to change? Pros and cons are appreciated.

 

Thanks!

 

 

As for those Advancers....drool....I would personally just stick with regular alumina shelves until you are ready for another big investment, since you're looking at investing in a kiln now.

 

 

Lol! It's funny how some folks drool over cars and jewelry and whatnot, and we drool over kilns and studio space! HA!



#46 JBaymore

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 01:57 PM

Wondering if the corelite or advancer shelves heat and cool at a rate that is closer to the heating and cooling of the clay?

I have issues with this on standard shelves when firing large flat platters or tiles.Solutions have been previously discussed for raising platters off shelves, but not whether changing shelves will help.

 

Look at the thermal conductivity number for the material the shelf is made out of.  That is a measure of how "fast" heat energy will tend to penetrate the shelf.  Look at the specific heat of the material the shelf is made out of.  That number indicates how much energy it takes to heat the shelf material itself up.  Look at the combination of specific heat and overall mass of one shelf relative to another to compare them.  That will tell you more about how much energy is going into the shelf to heat it up... or how it will tend to slow down the cooling.

 

best,

 

.......................john


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Professor of Ceramics; New Hampshire Insitute of Art

Guest Professor, Wuxi Institute of Arts and Science, Yixing, China

Former President and Past President; Potters Council
 

http://www.JohnBaymore.com


#47 Karen B

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 02:03 PM

 

Wondering if the corelite or advancer shelves heat and cool at a rate that is closer to the heating and cooling of the clay?

I have issues with this on standard shelves when firing large flat platters or tiles.Solutions have been previously discussed for raising platters off shelves, but not whether changing shelves will help.

 

Look at the thermal conductivity number for the material the shelf is made out of.  That is a measure of how "fast" heat energy will tend to penetrate the shelf.  Look at the specific heat of the material the shelf is made out of.  That number indicates how much energy it takes to heat the shelf material itself up.  Look at the combination of specific heat and overall mass of one shelf relative to another to compare them.  That will tell you more about how much energy is going into the shelf to heat it up... or how it will tend to slow down the cooling.

 

best,

 

.......................john

 

 

 

Thank you john.



#48 Pres

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 11:46 AM

I've been running an L&L now for over 30 years, and still find it doing well. Very little has needed replacement, and when it did L&L had the part to me in about 3 days. I am not an electrician, but a handy able to follow instructions kind of guy. The L&L's have proven easy to repair, and easy to fire.


Simply retired teacher, not dead, living the dream. on and on and. . . . on. . . . http://picworkspottery.blogspot.com/

#49 flowerdry

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Posted 06 February 2014 - 07:37 PM

My L&L came with tons of information.  I was quite impressed and have read it all.  Some of it 2 or 3 times. (It's not age....I've always been that way..)


Doris Hackworth

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#50 ShellHawk

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:50 AM

My L&L came with tons of information.  I was quite impressed and have read it all.  Some of it 2 or 3 times. (It's not age....I've always been that way..)

Me, too. But with age, it's not getting any better!  :D



#51 Pres

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 10:13 AM

Bailey has come in with an element holder in their high end kilns. These are fixed front loaders. They highlight the benefits of this ceramic element holder quite a bit in their info. They do not offer this in their top loaders. I believe there must be a copyright infringement deal with L&L, but that is only guessing.


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#52 Brian Reed

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 10:14 AM

back to the original question.  I am sure people here will tell you I am wrong, but I would go to your clay supplier and ask them what they have that is cheap and on sale and get them at low a cost as possible.  I picked up many shelves from him that were odd balls and they are working fine.  then as you learn more spend the money on nicer shelves as they need replacing.  That is what I did and it is working out great.  sure shelves break and warp, but at 20-30  dollars a shelf no big loss.


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#53 Mart

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 02:50 PM

What is this huge red monstrosity, attached to Bailey's kilns? OK, I know, it's the relay etc box that gets hot too.
But why is it on the front of the kiln? Really awful design. Rohde moved all this stuff to the left-back side of the kiln so you can have better access to your kiln from the front. Hard wiring the controller to relay box is also really weird design decision. Never mind that...

Those Advancers made me drool too. :) Any idea, who imports Advancers shelves to EU?
BTW, you can get those from that damn China for less than 100 USD a pop, if you buy 30 or so shelves.

#54 bartapau

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 04:28 PM

I looked over all the comments and didn't see any comments that were about Nitride Bonded Silicon Carbide Shelves. On the good side, they are super cheap, but what is the downside ? There has to be a downside. I am looking for lighter weight shelves, as my old 1" shelves are too heavy for me to lift into the kiln by myself.  



#55 Mark C.

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 06:33 PM

They are not as good as advancers in all regards-you would be better off with the corelites I feel than nitrate bonded.My old potter friend had tham and complained about them-he has since passed away so I cannot tell you the downside I just kniow there are some.
Mark
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#56 Darcy Kane

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 09:00 PM

I had a Skutt 1027 and the day I liked that kiln the best was the day I waved goodbye to it.  Bought an L&L from Neil and I've been a happy camper since.  I certainly don't fire on the schedule of a production potter but my cordierite shelves still look great, no warping or distortion and if/when they do I can buy news one a couple of times over for the price of Advancers.  Buying a kiln is a big deal (It was a bigger deal for me than buying a car!) so take your time now so you aren't kicking yourself in the butt later.  

 

My kiln requires 200 amp service which we had anyways, so my only outside expense was paying an electrician to install a service receptacle.  And as much as I like my iPhone and tricked up apps, I would never trust one to tell me what was going on with a 2000+ degree oven chugging away on my property, anymore than I would go off and leave my kitchen oven running.  This is one of those shopping decisions you will be glad to have in your rearview mirror.







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