Jump to content


Photo

What Mesh Sieve Do You Screen To For Dipping Glazes?


  • Please log in to reply
20 replies to this topic

#1 clay lover

clay lover

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,113 posts
  • LocationSoutheast

Posted 17 August 2013 - 08:33 AM

  I have been using up to a 60 mesh, and screening with a little sieve to 80 for spraying.  Would I benefit from buying a large screen and sieving my buckets to a fine mesh than 60?  How far do you go?

I have several different glazes with different ingredients, if that makes a difference..

I'm not getting grit on my pots, just wondering what, if anything, would change with more screening.



#2 TJR

TJR

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,709 posts
  • LocationCanada

Posted 17 August 2013 - 08:53 AM

I make all of my own glazes in 5 gallon buckets. That would be approx. 10,000 grams of glaze.

I sieve with an 80 mesh screen into a clean 5 gallon pail.

I then sieve the glaze back into the original 5 gallon pail [which I have washed], using a 100 mesh sieve.

The finer you sieve, the better the melt, especially for lower temperature glazes such as at cone 04.

Ash glazes I only sieve to 40 mesh, as I like the texture.

TJR.



#3 clay lover

clay lover

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,113 posts
  • LocationSoutheast

Posted 17 August 2013 - 09:31 AM

Thanks for your info.  I am curious as to why the finer mesh makes better melt.

 

I saw some ^6 pots at a high quality show last week.  The League of NH Craft's annual show in Sunapee.  Lots of high quality ^6 work which I don't usually see in my area, so really inspiring.  The glazes were the same formulas I am using, I recognized them and asked the potters. From MCSG mostly, but the look was so much better than mine, depth and surface.  And mine are pretty nice.    Now I am fixated on how to improve my glazes.  



#4 neilestrick

neilestrick

    Neil Estrick

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,395 posts
  • LocationGrayslake, IL

Posted 17 August 2013 - 09:36 AM

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.


Neil Estrick
Kiln Repair Tech
L&L Kilns Distributor
Owner, Neil Estrick Gallery, LLC
www.neilestrickgallery.com

neil@neilestrickgallery.com


#5 OffCenter

OffCenter

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,372 posts

Posted 17 August 2013 - 10:41 AM

I spray most of my glazes so have to run them through a 100 mesh screen. For a couple of them I have to do what TJR does and run them through an 80 mesh screen first.

 

Jim


E pur si muove.

"But it does move," said Galileo under his breath.

#6 Mark C.

Mark C.

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,959 posts
  • LocationNear Arcata Ca-redwood rain forest

Posted 17 August 2013 - 11:37 AM

I run everything thru an 80 mesh-I fire cone 10 and make it all from scratch-I dip pour -spray-all thru the 80 mesh.

Mark


Mark Cortright
www.liscomhillpottery.com

#7 Chris Campbell

Chris Campbell

    clay stained since 1988

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,624 posts
  • LocationRaleigh, NC

Posted 17 August 2013 - 11:44 AM

If my mesh is too fine I get stuff that does not pass through it but obviously needs to be in the glaze. How do you get those into the glaze? Am I not mixing it enough first?

Also, I think glazes improve if the raw ingredients are fine milled before ... I don't think the screen mills them any finer just breaks up clumps??

Chris Campbell
Contemporary Fine Colored Porcelain
http://www.ccpottery.com/

https://www.facebook...88317932?ref=hl

TRY ...   FAIL ...  LEARN ...  REPEAT


#8 neilestrick

neilestrick

    Neil Estrick

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,395 posts
  • LocationGrayslake, IL

Posted 17 August 2013 - 02:06 PM

If my mesh is too fine I get stuff that does not pass through it but obviously needs to be in the glaze. How do you get those into the glaze? Am I not mixing it enough first?

Also, I think glazes improve if the raw ingredients are fine milled before ... I don't think the screen mills them any finer just breaks up clumps??

 

Run the power mixer longer to break up as many clumps as possible before sieving.

 

Most glaze materials are 200 mesh or finer, however that's not always 100% accurate, and some materials clump up in to quite hard chunks that can be difficult to break up with the screen. You should technically be able to run a glaze through a 180 mesh screen, although it will take a long time to work it through a screen that is that close to the particle size of the materials. I think anything over 100 mesh is overkill for most applications, or if it won't go through your sprayer. The only time I've seen anything finer required was using a particular stain that would clump enough to cause speckles in the glaze rather than being perfectly dispersed in the glaze. In that case, the stain was sieved through a 180 with a small portion of the glaze batch. There was no reason to sieve the entire batch that finely, since only the stain was the problem.

 

A ball mil will actually reduce the particle size, although for most glazes it's overkill. Not worth the effort most of the time. Many glaze manufacturers us high shear mixers for their glazes, which negates the need for sieving and can also reduce the particle size.

 

If you're not having any problems with the 80 mesh, no need to do anything finer. The small the mesh size, the longer it will take to sieve the glaze.


Neil Estrick
Kiln Repair Tech
L&L Kilns Distributor
Owner, Neil Estrick Gallery, LLC
www.neilestrickgallery.com

neil@neilestrickgallery.com


#9 Wyndham

Wyndham

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 479 posts
  • LocationSeagrove NC

Posted 17 August 2013 - 02:13 PM

I use 80 mesh but the lithium I have gets caught in that screen so mortar & pestle if I have too much big stuff.

 

If I mix a 10k glaze batch and only have a few grams in the screen, I toss it as that's not enough to matter in that much glaze.

 

I've gotten some titanium dioxide that just mucks up in the new glaze and have to push it through the screen. After that screening the Titanium disperses well into the glaze and no prob after that.

 

Wyndham



#10 Pres

Pres

    Retired Art Teacher

  • Moderators
  • 2,467 posts
  • LocationCentral, PA

Posted 17 August 2013 - 06:34 PM

I use some small amounts of granular material in some glazes. These I add after the two sieves with 80 mesh. Then I remix the glaze to disperse.
Simply retired teacher, not dead, living the dream. on and on and. . . . on. . . . http://picworkspottery.blogspot.com/

#11 Marcia Selsor

Marcia Selsor

    Professor Emerita, Montana State University-Billings

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,701 posts
  • LocationOn the Border by the Sea, Brownsville, TX

Posted 17 August 2013 - 09:50 PM

Usually 60-80 mesh.

Marcia Selsor
http://www.marciaselsorstudio.com

Professor Emerita Montana State University-Billings
 


#12 hershey8

hershey8

    John Autry

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 167 posts
  • LocationMineral Bluff, Ga

Posted 14 August 2015 - 05:16 PM

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.

So screening is not  necessary if you mix well, say with a stationary blender or stick blender? Are there other mixing alternatives that would be satisfactory for larger volumes?  What is the largest batch you would use a stick blender on?



#13 hershey8

hershey8

    John Autry

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 167 posts
  • LocationMineral Bluff, Ga

Posted 14 August 2015 - 05:16 PM

 

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.

So screening is not  necessary if you mix well, say with a stationary blender or stick blender? Are there other mixing alternatives that would be satisfactory for larger volumes?  What is the largest batch you would use a stick blender on?

 



#14 Grype

Grype

    making pots

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 683 posts
  • LocationGeorgia

Posted 14 August 2015 - 10:06 PM

 

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.

So screening is not  necessary if you mix well, say with a stationary blender or stick blender? Are there other mixing alternatives that would be satisfactory for larger volumes?  What is the largest batch you would use a stick blender on?

 

 

I made a lot of 1500-2000 gram batches in the past and I didn't sieve them. I just use the immersion blender for several minutes moving it around and up and down. I pull the blinder up and then stick a tile into the glaze. If it comes out nice and smooth I consider the job done. If it comes out with anything, I will blend more, test again and repeat.

 

I do sieve the larger batches though as there are just so much more ingredients and places for the stuff to hide in the bucket clumped together. 


Joseph Luke Fireborn

http://josephmakespots.com

 

 


#15 Pres

Pres

    Retired Art Teacher

  • Moderators
  • 2,467 posts
  • LocationCentral, PA

Posted 14 August 2015 - 10:44 PM

Interesting, I just made up a 7500 g. bucket of Cream Rust. Seven ingredients in the glaze with two oxides. I really use my drill mixer for about 10 minutes, but then still run it twice through an 80 mesh screen to make certain there are no lumps.. . . of which there were some. If you are doing a gallon bucket or so, I would think you could probably get away with it. As this is about 4 gallons of glaze, I had best screen. :huh:

 

best,

Pres


Simply retired teacher, not dead, living the dream. on and on and. . . . on. . . . http://picworkspottery.blogspot.com/

#16 Min

Min

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 757 posts
  • LocationCanada

Posted 14 August 2015 - 11:37 PM

Wollastonite, zinc, tin and probably some more I can't think of right now seem to agglomerate both in the bag and some of them in the glaze slurry if it's left for a while. After all the work of making pots a few extra minutes sieving the glaze really is not a big deal. Save one pot from the shard pile and it's worth the effort. 80 mesh is what I've always used for glazes and 60 for slip.

 

 

 



#17 neilestrick

neilestrick

    Neil Estrick

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,395 posts
  • LocationGrayslake, IL

Posted 15 August 2015 - 08:39 AM

 

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.

So screening is not  necessary if you mix well, say with a stationary blender or stick blender? Are there other mixing alternatives that would be satisfactory for larger volumes?  What is the largest batch you would use a stick blender on?

 

 

I've used the stick blender on 2 gallon batches before. It takes a few minutes, but it's less cleanup than two buckets and a sieve. A blender is a high shear device, so it does and excellent job of getting rid of clumps. A drill mixer does not do nearly as good a job because it does not run at high RPMs, and the mixing blades are not made to cut, but rather just to move the material around, so it would take much longer to get it smooth that way.


Neil Estrick
Kiln Repair Tech
L&L Kilns Distributor
Owner, Neil Estrick Gallery, LLC
www.neilestrickgallery.com

neil@neilestrickgallery.com


#18 TJR

TJR

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,709 posts
  • LocationCanada

Posted 15 August 2015 - 01:52 PM

 

I have always sieved to 80 mesh. No problems. The finer the particles, the easier they melt. However the screen isn't reducing the particles size of the materials, it's breaking up clumps. Enough mixing and you don't need to screen at all.

So screening is not  necessary if you mix well, say with a stationary blender or stick blender? Are there other mixing alternatives that would be satisfactory for larger volumes?  What is the largest batch you would use a stick blender on?

 

I would always screen through a sieve. If you ball mill your glaze, you can make large amounts depending on the size of the ball mill.The glaze comes out at 200 mesh after ball milling.

TJR.



#19 Mark C.

Mark C.

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,959 posts
  • LocationNear Arcata Ca-redwood rain forest

Posted 15 August 2015 - 05:17 PM

I run all my life thru an 80 mesh because I do not like issues with glazes from small stuff.
Mark
Mark Cortright
www.liscomhillpottery.com

#20 oldlady

oldlady

    single firing an electric kiln to cone 6

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,883 posts
  • Locationharpers ferry west va and pinellas park fl

Posted 15 August 2015 - 09:17 PM

i sieve to remove the various legs, wings, etc. of the insects that commit suicide in my tightly closed containers of ingredients.  they probably don't add up to many grams but i still want them out.  60 mesh is fine for me.

 

once, in a shared studio, i wanted to use the glaze in a 30- gallon trash can.  it had not been sieved for years and had a buildup on the inside walls about 6 inches thick.  i found broken pots in the bottom whose shards were so old they were of interest to anthropologists. 


"putting you down does not raise me up."




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users