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Adding Mason Stains To My 100G Clear Cone 6 Glaze For Test Tiles


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#1 Marge

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 07:42 PM

So... I've mixed 3 different 100g batches of clear, added water and sieved. I want to add different percentages of Mason stains and try out some test tiles.  What is my next step? Let's say I'm adding 5 and 10% of orange stain, I don't want to use my entire 100g batch for 5% of stain. Do I weigh my wet clear and add the stain to that? If I have 100g of dry clear I could take out and weigh a certain amt but I'm afraid I won't get all of the dry ingredients blended well enough if my sample.  I've read about taking some out and placing in cups and adding different percents of stains.  I guess I'm just confused about how much wet vs. dry and how much stain. For example, "10% of the stain" would be .1 of my 100g batch, but i don't want to use the whole batch at once.

 

Did this make any sense? I think I just confused myself!! I have a good digital scale, I just need some guidance.

 

Thanks in advance----Margie :(



#2 TJR

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 09:25 PM

O.K. Here goes;

If you have 100 grams of dry glaze in a cup with water , you will have 100% of your sample. This will make a paper coffee cup of glaze-not a styrofoam cup-too small.

So if you have a cup with 100 grams of dry glaze,1% of stain will be one gram.

Say you want to test three stains in your clear glaze. Mark your cups A,B,and C

Cup A will be orange stain.You will have 100 grams of dry clear glaze plus water. Add one gram of orange stain. Mix it up. Dip a test tile. Mark 1% orange on the bottom of the tile.

If you want to try a test of 5% orange stain, add 4 grams of stain to your cup A. You already have one gram or 1% stain in the cup. 1gram plus 4 grams equals 5 grams of stain or 5%. To get 10 %, you need 10 grams of stain. You already have 5 in the cup, so you add another 5 to the same cup. Don't forget to make a test tile every time you add stain.

In cup B, you try another stain in your 100 grams of clear glaze.

I hope this is "clear". Get it?

TJR,



#3 Benzine

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 10:31 PM

O.K. Here goes;

If you have 100 grams of dry glaze in a cup with water , you will have 100% of your sample. This will make a paper coffee cup of glaze-not a styrofoam cup-too small.

So if you have a cup with 100 grams of dry glaze,1% of stain will be one gram.

Say you want to test three stains in your clear glaze. Mark your cups A,B,and C

Cup A will be orange stain.You will have 100 grams of dry clear glaze plus water. Add one gram of orange stain. Mix it up. Dip a test tile. Mark 1% orange on the bottom of the tile.

If you want to try a test of 5% orange stain, add 4 grams of stain to your cup A. You already have one gram or 1% stain in the cup. 1gram plus 4 grams equals 5 grams of stain or 5%. To get 10 %, you need 10 grams of stain. You already have 5 in the cup, so you add another 5 to the same cup. Don't forget to make a test tile every time you add stain.

In cup B, you try another stain in your 100 grams of clear glaze.

I hope this is "clear". Get it?

TJR, [

I should be writing this stuff down/ copying it to a file for later, when I actually start experimenting with my own glaze mixes and such.


"Anything worth believing, is worth questioning"

#4 Roberta12

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 12:17 PM

O.K. Here goes;

If you have 100 grams of dry glaze in a cup with water , you will have 100% of your sample. This will make a paper coffee cup of glaze-not a styrofoam cup-too small.

So if you have a cup with 100 grams of dry glaze,1% of stain will be one gram.

Say you want to test three stains in your clear glaze. Mark your cups A,B,and C

Cup A will be orange stain.You will have 100 grams of dry clear glaze plus water. Add one gram of orange stain. Mix it up. Dip a test tile. Mark 1% orange on the bottom of the tile.

If you want to try a test of 5% orange stain, add 4 grams of stain to your cup A. You already have one gram or 1% stain in the cup. 1gram plus 4 grams equals 5 grams of stain or 5%. To get 10 %, you need 10 grams of stain. You already have 5 in the cup, so you add another 5 to the same cup. Don't forget to make a test tile every time you add stain.

In cup B, you try another stain in your 100 grams of clear glaze.

I hope this is "clear". Get it?

TJR,

Thank you Margie for asking the question.  Thank you TJR for a clear explanation!!!!!



#5 oldlady

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 01:37 PM

this is the easiest explanation i have ever seen, thanks TJR.  but someone will ask "well, if i used some of the 100 grams on the first test, won't that mean the next measurement won't be accurate since it isn't 100 grams anymore?"

 

tell 'em it is OK.

 

 

next time,  Marge, mix up your DRY ingredients into a container with a tight lid.  shake it for a minute or two to mix it all thoroughly.  then remove a small amount, say 20 grams, and put your percentages of stain into that amount of glaze.  work out the math and continue.  that way you will get more tests from the original 100 grams and you won't feel bad throwing out the leftovers when they are not satisfactory. add the water AFTER the stain and you have no problems. do not worry about sieving a test. save that for the whole batch. 

 

oh, yes, i don't know what kind of tap water you have and so i suggest the investment in a gallon of distilled water for making glazes.


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#6 Brooke•Millecchia

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 02:18 PM

Once your done testing, dry out your 100g test batches, stack and store them.  You never know, someday you may want to test the same glaze with another additive.  All you have to do is reconstitute.






#7 TJR

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 04:03 PM

 

O.K. Here goes;

If you have 100 grams of dry glaze in a cup with water , you will have 100% of your sample. This will make a paper coffee cup of glaze-not a styrofoam cup-too small.

So if you have a cup with 100 grams of dry glaze,1% of stain will be one gram.

Say you want to test three stains in your clear glaze. Mark your cups A,B,and C

Cup A will be orange stain.You will have 100 grams of dry clear glaze plus water. Add one gram of orange stain. Mix it up. Dip a test tile. Mark 1% orange on the bottom of the tile.

If you want to try a test of 5% orange stain, add 4 grams of stain to your cup A. You already have one gram or 1% stain in the cup. 1gram plus 4 grams equals 5 grams of stain or 5%. To get 10 %, you need 10 grams of stain. You already have 5 in the cup, so you add another 5 to the same cup. Don't forget to make a test tile every time you add stain.

In cup B, you try another stain in your 100 grams of clear glaze.

I hope this is "clear". Get it?

TJR,

Thank you Margie for asking the question.  Thank you TJR for a clear explanation!!!!!

 

You are welcome. I had to stop in the middle and make myself a cup of tea.Once you realize that 100 grams is 100% of your sample, you are laughing.

TJR.



#8 TJR

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 04:05 PM

 

O.K. Here goes;

If you have 100 grams of dry glaze in a cup with water , you will have 100% of your sample. This will make a paper coffee cup of glaze-not a styrofoam cup-too small.

So if you have a cup with 100 grams of dry glaze,1% of stain will be one gram.

Say you want to test three stains in your clear glaze. Mark your cups A,B,and C

Cup A will be orange stain.You will have 100 grams of dry clear glaze plus water. Add one gram of orange stain. Mix it up. Dip a test tile. Mark 1% orange on the bottom of the tile.

If you want to try a test of 5% orange stain, add 4 grams of stain to your cup A. You already have one gram or 1% stain in the cup. 1gram plus 4 grams equals 5 grams of stain or 5%. To get 10 %, you need 10 grams of stain. You already have 5 in the cup, so you add another 5 to the same cup. Don't forget to make a test tile every time you add stain.

In cup B, you try another stain in your 100 grams of clear glaze.

I hope this is "clear". Get it?

TJR, [

I should be writing this stuff down/ copying it to a file for later, when I actually start experimenting with my own glaze mixes and such.

 

Ben;

Just email me if you get stuck. I can explain it again.

T.



#9 Marge

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 04:11 PM

I am SO thankful for this website and everyone who "sets me straight"!  I'm in my studio now, typing with my respirator with a quick question... I'm mixing "Mike's Clear" from a forum awhile ago (thanks to "oldlady")  I never thought of NOT sieving for my test tiles.  Great time saver.  My question is, do I have to let the glaze sit overnight before dipping test tiles? I've read that the glaze has to sit for hours after mixing...

Thanks!! :rolleyes:



#10 oldlady

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 05:24 PM

 think about it.  minerals are just wet and combined once you mix your test.  what will change after sitting there overnight?  if the test is mixed with too much water, you will get evaporation.  i can't think of any other change resulting from delay.    so, do not add too much water at the beginning.

 

 

(we could ask each molecule of mineral whether it is now more comfortable with its neighbors but that seems unrealistic.)


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#11 oldlady

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 05:32 PM

there is one thing more, the length of time you leave the test in the glaze.  that equals thickness of application.  you should establish a routine now, at the beginning of your experience and decide how you will time the tests.  some folks count seconds.  decide how long you will hold the test tile and keep to that so all tests from now on will be comparable. just count to 5 or six at a reasonable speed and do it the same each time.


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#12 oldlady

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 05:58 PM

i have to turn off the tv set.  can't think anymore with that in the background.  

 

marge, start off right.  get a nice 3 ring binder with plastic sleeves to hold the single sheet of paper with your glaze recipe on it in the top corner. write in ink, you will be reading it for years.  assign a letter  to that recipe, if you are starting with mikes clear use A.  step two, make sure you number your test tiles somehow, whether with oxide wash or underglaze or carved into the tile.  mark the first test tile A 1. that test should be plain mikes clear with no added color.

 

the next test will still be mikes clear so start with A and assign 2 to it.  keep a record of what colorants in what percentage you use on each test.  i keep mine in a separate notebook that reads something like this.    A2  2% cobalt carbonate.    A3 3% cobalt carbonate  A4 3% red iron oxide  A4 5% red iron oxide.  i leave two lines blank for possible notes.  some read  AWFUL  do not try pink stain!  or some such.

 

the reason for the two books is this.  the big binder includes room for you to note when you mixed the recipe and the quantity you made up.  it also gives you room to put notes like this   Great clear glaze, easy to mix covers colors well needs to be thinner next time (or something like this)  seems silly when you only have one recipe but after a few years and many more glazes you will appreciate the notes more.  think long term.  twenty six letters lets you test a lot of glazes before you have to start again.   numbers 2 through whatever allows you to try many colors in the same base glaze. keep your tests of each glaze on individual shoestrings or something else so you can check how the colors compare to other base glazes.  i can see you next year deciding whether to use the yellow made from mikes clear or the yellow made from the rutile recipe.  two strings, two tests. why shoestrings?  they are strong, they thread through the holes you made in your test tiles and you can hang them on a nail on the wall out of the way.

 

these suggestions are the result of my experience of not doing everything right the first time.  happy testing!!


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#13 Pugaboo

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Posted 15 July 2013 - 07:47 PM

OMG oldlady can you come live with me? Truly you are a marvel. I am on my way out to replace my little 5x7 lined notebook with a nice 3 ring binder, plastic sheets and since I am not yet ready to mix I'll just put in the printed out sheets of glaze recipes. I am thinking when I start mixing I will also take a picture of the completed tile and photoshop it into the print out along with the recipe and notes. Since I haven't mixed a single glaze yet not sure if this will be feasible or not but would kind of be nice to keep the Original glaze recipe facing out on one side of the clear sheet and slip the recipe with mixed amounts, notes, and photo on the other side.

Again you amaze me

Terry
The world is but a canvas to the imagination - Henry David Thoreau

#14 clay lover

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 08:06 AM

What do you do with the test tiles of things you think are yuck glazes? Do you keep them and where. I have 12,437,7865,4564,0000 Test tiles of glaze results that I will never use, they are labled and in boxes stashed everywhere. Why am I keeping them, someone remind me.

#15 minspargal

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 08:15 AM

Because maybe you are saving them for the mosaic lady????



#16 TJR

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 08:33 AM

What do you do with the test tiles of things you think are yuck glazes? Do you keep them and where. I have 12,437,7865,4564,0000 Test tiles of glaze results that I will never use, they are labled and in boxes stashed everywhere. Why am I keeping them, someone remind me.

You are keeping them as a reminder that that test didn't work. Otherwise you are destined to repeat this idea again. There is valuable information there,but in a negative way. If you keep a good record of your tests, you should say that test "A" failed, and know why.

All my tests are in boxes on the floor out of the way.

TJR.



#17 oldlady

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:05 AM

thank you pug lover,  you may have noticed that many recipes you see are identified by the originator with a color. one more thing to buy is a set of the dividers for your 3 ring binder so you can label them with colors so whenever you need a green glaze recipe you will find it in the green label section.  on that divider you enter the letter of any base glazes that you have tested with green and are successful for you. so there are several pages you have copied from books, emails, whatever that the originator labeled "Green".  once you make up the base glaze and assign a letter to the base glaze you will test it with blue, yellow,  red, purple, whatever.  after firing your tests you can put those results in your book and mark the dividers.  

 

say you assign letter   F  to a glaze that the originator called green.  once all your color tests are complete, put the letter F and the number on each of the matching color dividers with either a plus or a minus or pass or fail or whatever.  so later when you are looking for a yellow, your yellow divider says base glaze F was a success. then you look up base glaze F and make it again.  or compare F to H or whatever other base glaze you have as a success with yellow.

 

well, the above may sound like pie in the sky but it just suggests that you have a lot of future decisions to make and you should start thinking about them before you start.  yes, you may want to discard the plan somewhere down the road but i sure wish i had done this.


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#18 Roberta12

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:51 AM

thank you pug lover,  you may have noticed that many recipes you see are identified by the originator with a color. one more thing to buy is a set of the dividers for your 3 ring binder so you can label them with colors so whenever you need a green glaze recipe you will find it in the green label section.  on that divider you enter the letter of any base glazes that you have tested with green and are successful for you. so there are several pages you have copied from books, emails, whatever that the originator labeled "Green".  once you make up the base glaze and assign a letter to the base glaze you will test it with blue, yellow,  red, purple, whatever.  after firing your tests you can put those results in your book and mark the dividers.  

 

say you assign letter   F  to a glaze that the originator called green.  once all your tests are complete, put the letter F and the number on each of the dividers with either a plus or a minus or pass or fail or whatever.  so later when you are looking for a yellow, your yellow divider says base glaze F was a success. then you look up base glaze F and make it again.  or compare F to H or whatever else you have as a success with yellow.

 

well, the above may sound like pie in the sky but it just suggests that you have a lot of future decisions to make and you should start thinking about them before you start.  yes, you may want to discard the plan somewhere down the road but i sure wish i had done this.

Thank you so much for this information!   I am going to abandon my 5x7 index cards.....there is not enough room for notes, etc.  Thanks for the help.  Great idea.

 

Roberta



#19 oldlady

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 12:21 PM

i abandoned 5x7 cards years ago when i lost a wonderful recipe given to me by a vendor at a show in virginia.  i did not understand at all why this person brought only white bowls decorated with red and blue stars and filled all of his shelves with only this choice. but i did notice the quality of the white glaze and how evenly it covered his dark brown clay.

 

the white glaze was just what i had been searching for and he was kind enough to give the recipe to me.  i noted the recipe "flag white" in my book to remind me of the source and to let me picture it in my head and because he did not give me his name for the recipe.  i did nothing with it for a very long time.  when i finally tested it i made up 100 grams.  it was WONDERFUL! i used all 100 grams in testing it both over and under various underglazes and each test was amazing.

 

i had the recipe on a card which i removed from the plastic sleeve in my binder in order to mix it up. phone rang, people visited, time went by, life happened and when i went back to the glaze table the card was gone.  i have searched for years and finally found George Wettlaufer's glaze recipes (which i had overlooked as old fashioned since the book was written in the 1970s) and glory be!  there was a perfect white glaze. maybe it was the original one the flag man used.

 

so, naming your glaze recipes is tricky too.  if it has a name when you get it, keep it because any good printed glaze will be reprinted, emailed, featured in a magazine or any other way of broadcasting it.  having the same ingredients in the same quantity five times under different names is silly.if you want a name to remember it by, use the source as your reminder and write notes on the page you keep in the binder.  the ones i hate i marked only "on internet" or something equally unhelpful. 

 

and take the whole plastic bound page to the glaze table to mix it!


"putting you down does not raise me up."

#20 Joy pots

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Posted 16 July 2013 - 01:11 PM

I'm not a newbie,but I don't know how to change that section of the profile.

Hi, I put my glaze formulas on a spreadsheet and print the dividing lines. I add columns for checking off the ingredients each time I mix that glaze and date it. If I goof when mixing I will know and I have goofed on occasion. I also add increases in formula in the the following columns & leave space for checking again. I put the pages in a binder.
Joy




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