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#1 Mark C.

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 01:09 PM

I have not been on the server list for many years now-I heard that the old system crashed-can anyone tell me if this is true and what happened?I gave it up years ago as there where to many experts who had all the answers
Seems there still is a web version still going?
After 35+ years in clay I'm still learning-this site has all the modern features like photo uploads-thanks for putting it together-I'm a moderator on several other sites so I know the work involved
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#2 Chris Campbell

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 06:17 PM

If you are talking about the "Clayart" Listserv, it is still up and running. Just posted there today.

http://lsv.ceramics.....exe?A0=CLAYART

I like this forum because you can post images ... it is great when someone asks why did this happen? and you can look at a picture of it instead of trying to guess. This way people get answers that are truly helpful instead of stabs in the dark.

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#3 Jhenna Lopez

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 09:31 AM

If you are talking about the "Clayart" Listserv, it is still up and running. Just posted there today.

http://lsv.ceramics.....exe?A0=CLAYART

I like this forum because you can post images ... it is great when someone asks why did this happen? and you can look at a picture of it instead of trying to guess. This way people get answers that are truly helpful instead of stabs in the dark.


Hi cris thanks for the info.
Yeah i also like this forum, cause other forums are to strict you cant post any images. don't know why, so boring.



#4 Guest_The Unknown Craftsman_*

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 01:26 PM

Mark, here is a previous deiscussion on Clayart, for some ideas :

http://ceramicartsda...art-dead/<br />

#5 Mark C.

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 06:11 PM

Thanks TUC
Thats what I needed to know-as last time I tried it was pau-looks like that was a temp thing.
that answers a lot-I quit posting there for the exact same reasons John B did-in fact his rant sums up my entire experience there-he said-
(Personally, I don't think it has always been lacking. Depends on how far back you go.

As a long term college professor, I used to be very involved with posting on CLAYART (look in the archives Posted Image ). And many others from academia used to be on CLAYART actively also. CLAYART started via the academic community. In fact, I was involved in some of the first micro-computer utilization in studio applications and in college teaching (http://www.johnbaymo...CAcomputer.html ). If you read that article quoted there which I wrote for the 84 Boston NCECA journal, you'll notice the comments I made about creating an online potter's information center, which I also made even more strongly in the live panel presentation ("Computers In The Studio").

Those early ideas eventually evolved into CeramicsWeb and CLAYART. Richard Burkett announced the formation of the CLAYART listserve format in an email on August 17, 1992. There were tons of "academics" on there in the early days.

Lately I simply subscribe to the CLAYART list and glance at the daily digests when I can to see if something interests me. Occasionally, I still get the temptation to answer something, but then I come to my senses Posted Image .


As to the "why" of why I am no longer posting there ........... difficult to be frank on this:

When one posts a simple answer to a simple question on CLAYART, you will then get 6,000,000,000,000 other people posting their personal opinions as to exactly why the answer given is not PRECISELY correct to the nth degree and maybe omitted this certain minor aspect that happens in one-in-a-million cases. At least 3,000,000,000,000 of the people commenting on this have probably been doing clay work for one or two years as an avocation and have taken three classes at a community education center. So in too many cases, the persons doing all this commenting do not have the background or facts to say what they are saying. Worse, they seem to lack the common sense to realize this fact.

So what happens is that eventually you end up spending hours and hours and hours over days and days and days trying to steer the discussion back on track and justify your previous answer. What was a simple "case specific" answer that you wanted to give to be sincerely helpful to a single person turns into a "project".

And the correct answers to 90% of the questions showing up on CLAYART are:

1. ) Get even a basic book on ceramics and read it.

2.) Enroll in some ceramics classes.

3.) Ask your teacher.

4.) Test that and you can answer it yourself.

5.) When you have put in the years of study and hard work, you will easily understand this. An email answer is not the best solution for you educationally.


So a vast amount of the daily traffic there that you end up wading through could be eliminated if people just used the appropriate and necessary resources to study the material, and not want the "instant answers.....just add water".

Still worse, when someone spends hour after hour giving of themselves on that difficult and contentious venue, you get little to no "thanks" messages from the people benefiting from the free information. Just more and more questions.

The problem is not CLAYART, per se, it is the fact that too many people who really do not know what they are talking about tend to shout the loudest these days. And also that humbleness and civility and respect are kinda' dead in the age of Ren and Stimpy and South Park. The same danger that affects CLAYART certainly lurks in every online community.

CLAYART was and and likely still is a great resource. You unfortunately have to take it for what it is. And have the smarts to sort out the good people with solid information from the vast amount of "chaff".

Rant off........... Posted Image

best,

...............john
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#6 AmeriSwede

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 03:33 AM

"... the fact that too many people who really do not know what they are talking about tend to shout the loudest these days. And also that humbleness and civility and respect are kinda' dead in the age of Ren and Stimpy and South Park..."

............................................................................................................................................


So true, so very true, and one of the most annoying aspects of too many forums!
Which makes this place seem like a breath of fresh mountain air.






------Rick



Above all, it is a matter of loving art, not understanding it. (Fernand Leger
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#7 Dinah

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Posted 18 February 2012 - 08:10 PM

Consider this for getting thanks, folks! I love being a Potters Council Mentor. I get Thanks! All over the place! And my Mentee has set up this awesome Google Docs spreadsheet where Mentee took notes during our initial chat on the phone (an hour); then transcribed notes and takes action, records them, and then I'm able to reply. Absolutely wonderful. I loved being thanked for time and advice and having a grown-up chat about ceramics and ideas.

There's a tad bit too much bad-tempered didactic opinion on Clay Art, and scoring points off someone's well-meaning remark. Not so much lately, as a couple of personalities seemed to have been <86ed>. Like a lot of stuff on line there's a humor by-pass; or if it does emerge it's crude. Sledgehammer to crack a nut comes to mind. I browse the list, occasionally dive in, mostly off-line. I've had some very decent help about specific very specific dotted i's and crossed t's queries, but as a couple of folks have said above me here on this topic, it's the squeakiest wheel which gets the grease. There are some real two-brain types who take hours to reply on a daily basis, but oh boy their take on a situation is usually spot on. Always worth browsing a serious topic. For instance, the recent discussion regarding lids was fairly useful, but like many topics eventually deterioriated into hapless anecdotal chaff. One gets to know how the wind is blowing and takes cover.
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#8 Chris Campbell

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 12:37 PM

Clayart and the CAD forum ... something for everyone!

The Potters Council had some input in the seeds of this forum. Several of us on the Board regularly teach workshops and we knew there was a need for an Internet forum where new potters could ask beginner questions without fear ... and yes, most new/intermediate potters I met were afraid to post on clayart. Clayart can be intimidating to a potter who has never met any of these personalities. When you meet them, they are approachable but as we all know the typed word does not always convey the true person behind it.

So the main thing we wanted was for all questions to be answered with respect ... no, we did not want to be bland and 'nice' ... we wanted exchange of opinions and lively discussions ... but number one was respectful. Thanks to all of you this forum seems to be doing just that. It could not happen without the potters willing to ask and others willing to answer with care.

There is no one answer that fits all possibilities the question asks ... sometimes the only answer is "Try it and tell us what happens." That is where the image loading is fantastic. You ask what happened and the picture tells all. So much better than blind guessing. Also, being able to post the link to a whole previous discussion eliminates that dreaded "Go look in the archives!" answer.

I guess I just want to thank all of you for participating, and trusting and slowly turning this forum into a great place to ask questions.

Chris Campbell
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#9 Dinah

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Posted 26 February 2012 - 06:10 PM

The ability to upload an image to pad out a point is superb. I must use it more often.


What? No way. How do I upload from My Pictures? If it were easy more folks would be doing it. Sorry I didn't make a copy of your instructions for downloading a thumbnail a couple of weeks ago. sorry. :(
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#10 Matt Oz

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Posted 26 February 2012 - 07:23 PM

I have enjoyed reading the archives, especially the discussions on what true porcelain is.

I'm still looking for a deposit of petuntse in my back yard, I think I'm getting close.;)

#11 Pres

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Posted 26 February 2012 - 10:31 PM

I have enjoyed reading the archives, especially the discussions on what true porcelain is.

I'm still looking for a deposit of petuntse in my back yard, I think I'm getting close.;)


I taught HS for many years, and after retiring I still miss the interaction with the students, and having the privilege of solving so many of their ceramic problems. I also enjoy reading about, and pursuing more knowledge with the clay myself. Taking both of these aspects of my life in consideration this forum has been a great place for me. I get to help others out, and learn more about clay aspects that I have not been aware of or involved in. Thanks.

Simply retired teacher, not dead, living the dream. on and on and. . . . on. . . .                                                                                 http://picworkspottery.blogspot.com/





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