Mark C. Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 As Bruce mentions less may be more. I used to use lots of tools and I deffently own more than my share of them but as progressed I use only a few items which are water in a container a wooden stick with a angle to a dull point on it a sponge a spinning potters wheel music sometimes I will use a chamois but often its just a sponge now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What? Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 Will you be standing up or sitting down throwing? You will need a table or blocks to place the wheel on. The chair/stool and wheel should be a comfortable height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted August 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 Pug: TY for the encouragement. I have no expectations other than lots of failures starting out: part of learning. I have never done functional ware, and at this point have no plans to start. Just some nice forms with nice shoulders to highlight crystals- keep it simple. Mark: Been thinking alot about what Bruce said: I have 24,19, and 16g. aluminum out in the shop. Also have a 1 x 4 x 3/4 piece of walnut. run the walnut through a table saw to thin it, and a scroll saw to shape it, and a bench sander to smooth it...walla!! Cut me some metal ribs as well.. who knows?? I have a bucket full of 1/16 iron shims rusting away: could use them as ribs and oxide wash at the same time. Actually have Dado blades and shims: could cut the walnut in a wedge: 3/4 down to 1/8- would be more comfortable in my hand. What: My studio is 26 x 44, but I partitioned an 8 x 10 room in one corner with AC and heat. Nice big window overlooking the woods: so I can watch the critters play. Have my coffee maker and mini frig in there as well. Thinking I will just sit it on the work bench I built, sit on a nice bar stool. Relax, take a load off, and spin slop on the walls. Actually I was going to drape some plastic behind it, throw it out when it gets a nice coat of slim on it. Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GEP Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 Soft / flexible ribs are not for shaping. They do not have the "authority" to shape. They are for smoothing surfaces. Shaping ribs must be firm, such as the green or blue Sherrill ribs, or wooden ribs. A wooden rib with a straight edge is also essential. A straight line is also a strong statement about shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benzine Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 What's funny is the most important, widely-used tools (wood knife, needle tool, wood/ metal rib) are the ones that seem to last forever. I am still using those, I got in college... Minus the needle tools, because I just didn't learn not to do my heavy duty cutting with that thing... I can't suggest the Mudtools ribs enough, as others have already mentioned. I have never been disappointed with a tool I've purchased from them. My last purchase from them was their trim tool. That thing is awesome!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted August 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 GEP- a straight line is the basis of all architecture. Benz: if you like Mudworks, then you will like my list. I was already gifted a Kemper K25 wire cutter, Kemper Loop tool, and 2 Kemper trim tools when I bought my kiln, along with 500lbs of clay back when.. I have a plaster wedge board, and 2- 24 x 24 bisq slabs I also use to dry/wedge clay. Plenty of buckets of various sizes. So here is my list: Mudworks 4 way rib ( one side is straight).... looks like I can do most with just one rib. $7.00 Mudworks Foot rib, straight on one side, detail on ends, and curved back ( bowls) $8.00 Mud sponges Orange (2) $10.00 Xiem Firm silicone rib $ 6.00 Xiem Soft silicone rib $ 6.00 Xiem 3pc. trimming tool set- each end different (total 6 heads) $ 28.00 total $65.00 Will make my own metal ribs as I go along. Will make additional wood ribs as need arises. Will also make my own set of calipers, if the need arises. Trim tool set is pricey, but I think they will fit my hands better than the small ones. By the way Bruce, I remembered seeing a throwing video with a guy using an old credit card. My wife has a set of old silicone rubber spatulas that look like good throwing tools: just pull the handles off. She also has some old wooden spoons that look like they could be re-purposed. Figure out the rest when I get there. TY all for the input. Nerd Lady: I have people who do the cleaning.. Oh wait, that is me! By the way, I have a 10 x 10 concrete slab in front of the studio. Plan on putting the wheel on a portable table, roll out there in the spring and fall- enjoy the scenery and fresh air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnolia Mud Research Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 Nerd, Sounds like a good list. I make my own trimming tools from cheap table knives and hacksaw blades. A propane torch softens the metal to allow shaping and a heat tempering hardens the sharpened cutting edges. Handles made from scrap wood or friction tape allow me to have trimming tools that fit my hands and the work I make. But, I like to tinker as much as I like to make pots, so making my tools works for me. It is not the tool, it is the tool user that matters, or so said my master machinist mentor. LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Bridge Pottery Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 Bats - as many as you can lay out around your workshop like they have pots on drying. Tools - whatever you feel like, personal preference. I like a pointy 45~ degree 8inch long 2 linc wide rib to bevel the bottom of pot and loop trim tools. What are you making? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Min Posted August 13, 2016 Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 I think even your 24 gauge aluminum is going to be thick for a flexible metal rib. I put a micrometer on one of my stainless ones and it’s 0 point 1 mm. Your aluminum might be good for rigid ribs though. I personally don’t like the Xiem soft rib that I have, it’s way too thick compared to the Sherrill (MudTools) ones, doesn’t bend as nicely so kinda defeats the purpose of buying a soft one. For foam, you can save yourself some money and just use some scraps of upholstery foam when throwing, the high density stuff lasts ages. (Robin Hopper workshop tip) Old chair cushion or scraps from a foam shop. A cleaning cloth for eye glasses works really well for smoothing rims and never seem to wear out. Pic of the thickness difference between soft Xiem (orange) and Sherrill (red) soft ribs. Plus a flexible stainless one. (you can kind of see the difference in the rib thicknesses) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted August 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 13, 2016 What are you making? Joel: soon as I make something, will let you know. It will be very simple forms, trust me. ( skill-less in St. Louis.) if you are truly a beginner, Lady: lets call me a newbie: not exactly green. I did attend some throwing classes last year. I did watch and sit behind the wheel of the lady I have been paying to throw simple forms for me to test glaze run. I do have a very old wheel out there now, that I have turned on a few times: the pedal is stuck. So I have about 18-20 hours experience? I would call that green behind the ears. I personally don’t like the Xiem soft rib that I have, Min: what my supplier has available. So I looked around online: you and a few others seem sold on Sherril silicone ribs. So I will listen to the voices of experience, and order those instead. It is not the tool, it is the tool user that matters, or so said my master machinist mentor. LT: When I did my time as instructor in the union hall, I had a similar saying I told the greenies: "You work the material, the material does not work you." Translate to clay: "you work the clay, the clay does not work you." Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt Posted August 14, 2016 Report Share Posted August 14, 2016 You are about to become an expert in water management.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Reich Posted August 15, 2016 Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 Nerd, one more thing. You mentioned a planned wheel/stool setup. I would advise being very aware of any strains you put on your body and be prepared to modify your throwing position several times until you find what's "just right" for you. Also try throwing while standing. Very often, the absorbed concentration of learning smaller hand/arm motions distracts us from tensions building in back, legs and shoulders. I found that slightly widening the angle between knees and hips took a lot of strain from my lower back. Have fun! Rae ps, I think you'll find that silicone spatulas are not stiff enough to be authorative with clay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rae Reich Posted August 15, 2016 Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 Nerd, http://www.mudtools.com/?v=7516fd43adaa my dyslexic brain contracted Michael Sherrill to Merrill which are my favorite work shoes for standing on concrete. A hair dryer helps throw thinner and taller. I always taught students to throw cylinders first because most beginning pots end up as plates or bowls. Marcia Marcia, I hate standing on concrete so I looked up Merrills. I'm guessing your preferred style is "All Out Crush Tough Mudder" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Longer Member Posted August 24, 2016 Report Share Posted August 24, 2016 I'd get a better wheel. I tried to start out on an Artista and hated it. It put me off of throwing for years. She wound up using it for demos and that's about all it's good for. I would imagine Shimpo's version is better (I like them better than Speedball's stuff) but I still would recommend getting a "real" wheel even if used. I'd even say get a used Clay Boss over a new Aspire; why? Full-sized, reversible and FOOT PEDAL. It's easy for a beginner to get in trouble and even more so if they don't have quick direct control of wheel speed. You wouldn't teach someone to drive a car with a brick on the gas pedal, why do it with a pottery wheel? I have saved many of, what would have been floppy disasters, simply because I was able to get out trouble just as quick as I got into it. That's one reason why I like the VL Whispers as much as I do. When you slam a Whisper pedal off, it STOPS! I hate Clay Bosses ( but have several and unfortunately that's what I use at the house) but I can still save floppy pots with a CB that she'll swear I should just give up on simply because I can quickly slow down to a crawl and straighten the pot back up. IMO you need a decent wheel before you need any tools. You're biggest battle at first is going to be centering and you should already have the tools you need for that on you. Here's a Bailey that should be somewhat close. If they still have it, go throw $250 at them and see what happens. http://columbiamo.craigslist.org/art/5719530834.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted August 24, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2016 Dirt: I get what you are saying, and why you are saying it. I can afford any wheel I so choose, so it is not a monetary consideration. As mentioned, I took a few lessons last winter: and that is what concerns me. I cannot honestly say that I enjoyed it. Although I think part of that was not being comfortable with it. By the way, the Aspire comes with an optional foot pedal which can be used with any model. (if I understood it right.) I will look one last time, will be going over there to pick one up in another two weeks: finally at the end of "Flipper." house. Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted August 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2016 Dirt: Sent an email to the owner of the craigs list ad you posted. Columbia, Mo is just over an hour from me: so no big deal to drive out there. Get more info, never know. Nerd Edit: by the way for those standing on concrete: they do make anti-fatigue matts for that purpose. I have one in front of my slab roller, in front of my glaze table, and one at the mixing station. The big box stores have them, bought mine at a restaurant supply house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted August 25, 2016 Report Share Posted August 25, 2016 I'd put in my vote for a better wheel also for a totally new beginning thrower. If you are not looking to really make throwing a long term high priority in your clay adventures...... look for a used one... or a new Brent B or something like that. You probably won't need "horsepower" or torque like even a Brent C ..... and you don't need to spend the $ for quiet of a Shimpo Whisper. Check "The Potters Attic" on Facebook for used equipment ads. And Craigslist. And anything your local Potters Guild / club might have. best, ................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Longer Member Posted August 27, 2016 Report Share Posted August 27, 2016 and you don't need to spend the $ for quiet of a Shimpo Whisper. ................john It's too quiet IMO. Sometimes I just don't realize how fast I'm going until it's too "plate". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted August 27, 2016 Report Share Posted August 27, 2016 It's too quiet IMO. Sometimes I just don't realize how fast I'm going until it's too "plate". I'm not a big fan of the Whispers. We have a bunch of them at the college...and for classroom use they are WONDERFUL. The quiet is a god-send. And for most student use... they have plenty of torque. But for larger work......... the torque can be an issue. For advanced classes I am sometimes demoing larger forms and when centering (in the traditional way) of 50 pounds.... I can stop that wheel easily. I've talked to the Shimpo folks about a higher horsepower/torque Whisper-type wheel.. and that said they are working on it........ but nothing yet. Note that Shimpo has some GREAT equipment that they sell in Japan that they do not import to they States. I think the problem is the price points. That particular equipment is expensive stuff. Most in the US would not pay for it. best, .....................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Longer Member Posted August 27, 2016 Report Share Posted August 27, 2016 That wouldn't surprise me given the configuration of the motor. We were at the right place at the right time and got ours brand-new off the showroom floor for $650. That was just $100 more than the Clay Boss sitting right next to it. There was no way to pass that deal up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted September 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Looks like its going to be a Shimpo VL whisper. I have tried Craigslist a few times: either barely miss them or plain ole junk. So from reading: it does have a 14" wheel head. It does have a 1/2 HP motor, and is ultra quiet ( important to me.) One final question for the throwers among us: I noticed Mudworks make batt systems. Yes, no, maybe? Guidance on batts please Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callie Beller Diesel Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Before investing in a big system, try a couple of plywood ones mounted on a clay patty ffirst, to see if they suit you. Bats are great of you're making large bowls, plates, etc,, but if you make mostly cylindrical things to start, and you should be, you might not need them right away. I should add, this is another area where how you like your tools to feel can come into play. I personally can't handle the feel of the plastic ones, and I prefer the 1/2" plywood. But by the same token, I know others don't like the plywood because they're heavier, and not as efficient on space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Longer Member Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 Before investing in a big system, try a couple of plywood ones mounted on a clay patty ffirst, to see if they suit you. Bats are great of you're making large bowls, plates, etc,, but if you make mostly cylindrical things to start, and you should be, you might not need them right away. I should add, this is another area where how you like your tools to feel can come into play. I personally can't handle the feel of the plastic ones, and I prefer the 1/2" plywood. But by the same token, I know others don't like the plywood because they're heavier, and not as efficient on space. I'd throw pots on cow patties as long as they didn't clunk. Man does that drive me nuts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhPotter Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 Nerd, For throwing smallish items this bat system is great. http://www.bigceramicstore.com/north-star-universal-bat-system.html I have thrown 3 lb tall cylinders using these bats. Also, great for mugs. You could probably make your own being a wood worker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 My preference is for wooden bats (when I use bats). For probably 90% of what I make I simply pick them up off the wheelhead. I often use a bat ON the wheelhead...... but it is there to make the working surface wood instead of metal. Nerd... maybe get 1 each of a plywood one (I like Bailey's), a MDF one, and a plastic one... and see what YOU like. When starting out....... it is good to learn how to pick up pieces off the wheelhead. It is about skill acquisition and development at the beginning stages..... not the pieces themselves. For smaller work... the Whisper is a NICE wheel. best, ......................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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