Ginny C Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 I have some very narrow little vases I'm going to glue to a separate base, also glazed, AFTER they are all glaze fired. I'd like to glaze them all the way down, so I will need to support them during the glaze firing, and I don't have small enough supports. Can i make wadding with just my regular B-Mix (cone 5) clay with maybe some sand wedged in? I plan to glue the wads in place before placing each vase in the kiln. I don't have any of the usual suggested ingredients around, but I do have some sand! Suggestions? thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcia Selsor Posted April 5, 2016 Report Share Posted April 5, 2016 It would be best to make them from the same clay so the shrinkage is the same. a thrown ring would be better than wodding. Marcia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatthewV Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 Shrinkage on a narrow base is insignificant. But the words "very narrow" are also very relative. Do the vases stand up on their own?? If yes, just have them sit on an extra layer of kiln wash-- on a broken bit of shelf if you have one. If there is space to put a ring of clay under them, that would work as well. If no... well... they are going to topple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biglou13 Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 can you get you hands on some shells? epk, fire clay? commercially made stilts? have u seen the technique for crystalline glazes? not tested @ 6 but similar to wood fire wadding.... (volume) 3 grog 3 clay (high fire/fire clay) 3 sawdust packed 1 sand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcia Selsor Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 when I made macro-crystalline glazed vases I learned the hard way that shrinkage was very significant. The practice back then (1971) was to high temp bisque to avoid it. When I was first experimenting, I had pieces fall over from the movement of shrinkage. The caustic glaze ate a 3 inch hole in the brick! Always use caution. Marcia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted April 6, 2016 Report Share Posted April 6, 2016 If you use your clay body as wadding it may fuse to your pot. You need a more refractory wadding, or coat the wad in kiln wash or alumina. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginny C Posted April 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Ahh. Neil's answer is helpful. Always nice to know the WHY! But I don't know if sand is "more refractory" than my clay... The skinny little vases are only about 1 1/4" or 1 3/4" in diameter (and about 4-5 inches tall), so they do stand up but not very securely. (They will be glued to a base after the glaze firing, so they don't need to be very stable on their own.) They are made of B-Mix clay which is what I would make little wads of. I guess I will coat them in kiln wash before gluing them on the vases. The reason for putting something under each is that I am glazing them clear down to the bottom. I DO have some stilts but not enough of the very small size I need for these. I'll be firing these tomorrow so I'll report on the results after that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 "Bullet-proof" wadding materials is 50% alumina hydrate and 50% of any kaolin (typically in the eastern USA ...EPK). best, ..................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glazenerd Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Marcia: It is 2016 and that part of crystalline has not changed since 1971. 50% alumina / 50% EPK is still the standard wadding as well: as John has pointed out. This mix will hold it in place: and the unequal COE will make it release easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginny C Posted April 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 Success, but actually didn't use any wadding. I discovered that the little vases fit on top of my 1 inch shelf stilts. After glazing each I glued them each to one stilt. A few didn't stick but it didn't matter after all. It was easy to set the stilt where I wanted it and just set the vase on top. None fell over. I will now try to attach some photos. One of them ready to go into the kiln and two after the firing. My husband epoxied them to the base and I used them for a special breakfast for friends this morning. Hmm. Is there a way to rotate a vertical photo?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flowerdry Posted April 11, 2016 Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 Kudos to you, Ginny C for following up with results....and pictures too! They look great. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldlady Posted April 11, 2016 Report Share Posted April 11, 2016 glad you were able to fire them successfully. are those tulips out already?? in indiana? HOORAY spring must be on its way. (those are posts under your vases. stilts are some small shape or a bar with wires sticking up to hold lowfire work off the shelf so the bottom can be glazed. stilt marks are those tiny blips of unglazed clay you sometimes see on lowfire wares.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginny C Posted April 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2016 Thanks, Doris! And thanks, Old Lady, for clarifying posts vs stilts for me! (I bet I'm older than you are...) I do have some stilts but they were not quite small enough for several of these skinny vases. I have used them frequently under my mid-fire (cone 6) pots. Didn't know they were only for low-fire. I use them just in case of glaze running... Actually, I bought the tulips at Kroger's! But our daffodils are blooming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dricherson Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 The 50% alumina / 50% EPK wadding mix has been a revolution for me in the ease of packing my kiln! I roll it out and cut into small squares and dry. Hot glue as many of them as needed to the bottom of the pots and fire! And they are reusable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreaB Posted April 23, 2016 Report Share Posted April 23, 2016 Quick question - what is EPK wadding mix? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted April 23, 2016 Report Share Posted April 23, 2016 I think you are maybe mis-reading the above posting. One particular wadding mix is 50% alumina hydrate and 50% EPK. Does that help? It is not 50% EPK wadding MIX that is half of the recipe. best, ...................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krayart Posted December 15, 2016 Report Share Posted December 15, 2016 Hi, I am new here and not sure how to post my own questions in a new forum. There doesnt seem to be any link to start a new forum question. I have question on wadding. My boss uses a wadding mixture of 50 parts EPK and 50 parts ball clay that is mixed together with water to create a dough which we then use to put between the kiln furniture and shelves to act like a glue so that as we are building up the each shelf it is sturdy. Do most people do that or is it not necessary? My other more important question is we have a bag of Kaolinitic Clay powder which I know is an ingredient in EPK, but I need to make more wadding and and we do not have any more EPK. Can I mix 50 parts Kaolinitic clay powder and 50 parts OM4 Ball Clay and maybe throw in alittle Alumina to make wadding for the glue part of our shelf making? FYI this would be for an electric kiln...... Any advice would be much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted December 15, 2016 Report Share Posted December 15, 2016 Hi, I am new here and not sure how to post my own questions in a new forum. There doesnt seem to be any link to start a new forum question. I have question on wadding. My boss uses a wadding mixture of 50 parts EPK and 50 parts ball clay that is mixed together with water to create a dough which we then use to put between the kiln furniture and shelves to act like a glue so that as we are building up the each shelf it is sturdy. Do most people do that or is it not necessary? My other more important question is we have a bag of Kaolinitic Clay powder which I know is an ingredient in EPK, but I need to make more wadding and and we do not have any more EPK. Can I mix 50 parts Kaolinitic clay powder and 50 parts OM4 Ball Clay and maybe throw in alittle Alumina to make wadding for the glue part of our shelf making? FYI this would be for an electric kiln...... Any advice would be much appreciated Welcome, Top right corner of the main forum section page is a black button that says "Start New Topic"... Click that to cerate a new thread. Using some wadding mix on shelf posts in any kiln is certainly a good way to make a stable load and get things really level. In smaller kilns, unless the shelves and/or posts are pitted and/or warped.... it is probably a bit of "overkill". For a soda, salt, or wood kiln........ it is pretty much a necessity to keep the posts from sticking to the shelf bottoms. In a larger electric or gas kiln (say maybe 40+ cubic feet) not a BAD idea to help make the load more stable. In a 7 cubic foot hex electric.... with maybe a stack of 5-6 shelves tall at most........ probably not necessary at all. But will not HURT anything. "Kaolinitic Clay" as a term (unusual) basically says it is something that is more or less a kaolin. Mix that 50% with 50% alumina hydrate... and you have "kiln wadding". Any kaolin with 50% alumina hydrate will work as wadding pretty darn well. In fact,...... for gas and electric high fire...... 50% kaolin and 50% silica works OK. Or 33.3% any kaolin, 33.3% alumina hydrate, 33.3% silica is a pretty standard kiln shelf wash mix that makes a good (non woodfire/salt fire) wadding also. best, ................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krayart Posted December 16, 2016 Report Share Posted December 16, 2016 Thank you so much John for your thorough response, it was very helpful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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