High Bridge Pottery Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 So I need some sodium silicate and I happened across somebody making it from oven cleaner (sodium hydroxide) and silica gel. Has anybody ever tried this out before? Going to look into it a bit more but it seems a lot cheaper than buying it. Seems like an interesting material I don't know much about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 It's cheap. Just buy a pint. I don't know what it costs in England, but here you can get a pint for $2.25. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 Apparently a bit pricier in the UK! Wow! http://mistralni.co.uk/products/sodium-silicate-solution-q70 http://www.amazon.co.uk/500ml-Water-Sodium-silicate-liquid/dp/B00BVZ66JC http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/500ml-Water-glass-Sodium-silicate-liquid-glass-/140726670858 best, .......................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldlady Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 neil, where do you shop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JBaymore Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 Yeah .... it is interesting stuff... with many uses. (One I learned is in pyrotechnics!) A basic deflocculant for slips. Glue for attaching ceramic fiber gaskets to bricks. And so on. I just did a demo in Jingdezhen (China) in using sodium silicate in creating controlled surface textures in throwing. Many there had never seen that before. Apparently it is hard to get there...... I had to bring it from the US. best, ...................john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Bridge Pottery Posted November 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 I wanted to experiment with it as a refractory glue. Looked like I could get 2kg of the raw materials for the same price as 500ml solution. Also need some for slip deflocculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilestrick Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 neil, where do you shop? I just did a quick search and found it at Axner for $2.50/pint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babs Posted November 8, 2015 Report Share Posted November 8, 2015 Also lengthens to shelf life of eggs.. if you coat the shells with it. Interesting rural fact... $10.78/litre Aus. Apparently a pwder form available... what would yo mix it with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted November 8, 2015 Report Share Posted November 8, 2015 With prices as low as £8.75 for 1litre inc P&P it hardly seems worth the effort (but if it's fun...). http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sodium-Silicate-Solution-40-Glass-Water-1-Litre-Professional-Seller-/131127341271 ... advertised with a surprisingly full specification Moderately interesting document at: http://www.pqcorp.com/Portals/1/docs/Sodium%20and%20Potassium%20silicates%20brochure%20ENG%20oct%202004.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy Eberhardt Posted November 9, 2015 Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 Thanks a peach there, Neil! I just spent nearly and hour, drooling over all of the goodies available at Axner! Gaaaah! So many cool tools! So little money!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 With prices as low as £8.75 for 1litre inc P&P it hardly seems worth the effort (but if it's fun...). http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sodium-Silicate-Solution-40-Glass-Water-1-Litre-Professional-Seller-/131127341271 ... advertised with a surprisingly full specification Seems like a high water content. Is that normal? Might have to buy some of this. My pottery supplier sold me a 2oz bottle last time I needed it. Mind, they didn't have a price at the time, so I don't think I ever actually paid for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRankin Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 Amy, I recently drove an hour from my home to a ceramic supply store in New Jersey just to check them out and buy some clay and glazes. I figured the tolls would cost me about the same as the shipping if I ordered online. I wound up spending almost three hours there walking around, drooling, touching everything and buying things I "needed." So, I understand. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Seems like a high water content. Is that normal? UK suppliers seem to sell "sodium silicate" in two strength 75 & 1400Tw (degrees Twaddle). Personally I found the 140 to be very difficult to handle and measure. Haven't tried the 75, buying Dispex last time I needed a deflocculant. IIRC most recipes just say sodium silicate and don't give a strength. I've no idea what strength(s) are normal in the US. Of the URLs given in this thread so far: - the Axner ref gives a trade-name but no strength, although recommending diluting 50:50 with water - a MSDS for the brand gives a s.g. of 1.39 [=780Tw?] http://www.muirbeachcsd.com/documents/n_sodium_silicate.pdf - the Mistral ref is 750Tw - the pure-water refs don't seem to give a strength - my APC Pure ref gives a strength of 82-860Tw So this is the strength I would buy for use as a deflocculant (or dilute a more concentrated form down to). However I'm delighted you asked the question because I realise it probably isn't the right strength for the original poster. Who said in a later post: I wanted to experiment with it as a refractory glue. So I now realise that he probably wants/needs the sodium silicate as strong as he can get it. I haven't done a full search but as a guide Bath Potters offer 1400Tw at £3.14/500g & £23.08/5Kg; unfortunately plus P&P (£3.70 & £10). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you do go the DIY route have a look at the price of the silica-gel cat-litters (may have to: pick indicator crystals out, and dry in the oven). Watch the H&S. I have regarded caustic liquids a lot more warily since seeing a note pinned up in a wet-chemistry lab saying that somebody in another commercial lab had managed to dissolving part of his eyeball with N/10 NaOH (he recovered). N/10 NaOH is/was the standard titration strength and is pretty weak (0.4%?), so stronger, stickier and hotter solutions deserve careful handling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Bridge Pottery Posted November 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Thank you for all that peter, now when I am looking I will know about the twaddle degrees. Never seen that before as a measurement, Why do we all use surface gravity to measure liquids, degrees twaddle sounds so much better. I will make sure I have some safety specks and appropriate attire if I ever do get round to using the sodium hydroxide. Wanted to use it for casting slip too but really interested in sticking stuff together too or making a sort of castable refractory gluey thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterH Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 or making a sort of castable refractory gluey thing. Ever heard about geopolymers? These are synthetic aluminosilicates used as a type of cement (much closer to Roman cement than Portland cement). Also - just possibly - what parts of the pyramids were made from (there is a JACS paper). Also used in the ACS mug-drop event. https://geopolymerhouses.wordpress.com/2011/10/18/super-cements/ http://makezine.com/2009/10/27/super-cements-aka-geopolymers/ http://www.wired.com/2009/10/super-concrete-in-the-us-military-iran-and-the-pyramids/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 Seems like a high water content. Is that normal? buying Dispex last time I needed a deflocculant. Oops, yes it was Sodium Dispex I bought last time and there's none on ebay ........ Hides head in hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pres Posted November 12, 2015 Report Share Posted November 12, 2015 I needed some in a hurry one day, for magic water. Found that radiator sealant has it in it, along with some other stuff. I poured off the top liquid, and used this clear liquid as usual in the magic water and it worked fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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